Are you happy with the spinoff rosters on Nintendo Switch?

[Dorayakiss]

Right now we don't really know Nintendo's next step. Most past known spinoff subjects have appeared on the current platform.

(Future Olympics' fate is not clear. There is Sluggers but it's destined to be all-stars roster if it happens on Nintendo Switch.)

Now until Nintendo Switch's end, either Nintendo surprisingly introduce new subjects, or they decide to turn back to add DLCs to all the released games.

So assume that Mario spinoffs have called it a day, do you think Nintendo did a good job on the current console? Or there are parts you're not happy with?

I'm going to do two lists for used and unused contents:

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For official contents:

*Frankly, I think the general rosters don't really have exciting newcomers to attract consumers.

**We have Pauline. We know she has always been a deserving veteran for spinoffs, but it's just very... awkward to make her as almost the only stimulus for every single spinoff. She'd be fresh at start, but after several times, you'd have to add some other big faces next to her to heat up the crowd.
－－Even consider that she was already supposed to be in some WiiU games, her belated entry to Nintendo Switch titles can hardly be called a bonus when she's already an official main cast for decade.

**The other probably as exciting addition as Pauline would be King Bob-omb, who's a veteran boss since early mainline. But if we don't count Tour, Super Rush would be the only console title he has applied as a player so far.

*Needless to say Olympics rosters have been notorious since the third title. Just feel awkward since its past release frequency could had been a very proper reason to change roster units more easily.

*I'm just not a fan of Super Mario Party's "minion vs main cast" theme. I know minions have been playable in past party games and they have many solid supporters who still want them this time, but this theme rather worsen the diversity of spinoff rosters which usually ignore that Bowser's army isn't the only faction to rival in Mario world. Would had been much better if it handled like Sluggers.

*I'm not sure if it's officially proven, but Super Rush and Battle League feel really like interrupted in DLC plans. Birdo and Toadette are exclusive to each game despite they're obviously planned for the other one.

*Kart 8's case is abit weird. We know DX version turned it into the biggest roster for the series ever, but as Tour served as the source of new contents and remake, it's hard for fans to ignore the fact several main characters are still exclusive to the Tour version, especially some have been in high demand for console version.

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For unused contents:

*I always say it and I now say it again, what's the point to make King K.Rool a Smash fighter if he's not going to reappear anytime soon?

*Babies, as I mentioned recently.

*Koopalings' situation is kinda awkward now. They can not really fit in medium size rosters if all seven are always together. But I feel like they also deserve some chance to enter different spinoffs. I tend to support them to apply individually if that is the case.

*Dixie's entry to Tour before her failure to console roster is also kinda awkward. The final MK8 trailer obviously wants to cater to DK gang, but all fans have already considered Dixie as part of it so I don't think that the final MK8 DLC stunt really worked out well.

*Funky not being to more spinoffs is also kinda sad. I don't really like MK8's dedication to MKWii when Nintendo just ignore that Funky has way more potential to show outside racing.

*I'm not sure if Cranky is a highly demanded character but.... the Super Mario bros Movie was indeed a weird ad in terms of selling a racer you cannot enjoy in real Mario Kart. It would had been a wise move if Cranky and General Koopa got into spinoffs on the name of movie collaboration.

*I understand Nabbit is also not a hyping spinoff addition, but since Miyamoto likes him enough to grant him more mainline entry, I don't see the point for him to miss out all recent spinoffs on console.

*My take on Professor E.Gadd, Poochy and Warioware crew are similiar with Nabbit and KRool's. I mean it's awkward to keep their activity in mainline, yet refuse them to compete with other characters in all-stars spinoffs.

*Aside from the old characters, I also mentioned that the poor advertising for new games like Treasure Tracker, Odyssey and Luigi's Mansion 3 is awkward. We had Sprixies and Rosalina in new rosters for promotion use before, but recent mainline characters just don't get the same treat. I think new mainline games play important roles to push the franchise forward, so the spinoffs also need to make some progress to show that they're not just dead in water. Also same for the Illumination movie, it seems not wise to refuse any exclusive tie up plans.

 

[Nightwicked Bowser]

I haven't bought any of these since I'm not into those kind of games.

 

[LeftyGreenMario]

Mario Tennis Aces is like the only one where I thought the roster was even on par or superior with the equivalent games from the GCN generation. Such nice newcomers like Chain Chomp, Piranha Plant, Dry Bones, and we have welcome veterans like Paratroopa and Shy Guy. Even then, it's lacking Baby Mario, a character that Camelot themselves reintroduced into the spinoffs!

 

[Ray Trace]

Baby Luigi is playable in only one Switch game which happens to be just a port of a decade old game.

2/10

I'm not content.

 

[winstein]

As long as Daisy and Waluigi are playable in most of these it's all good. They are yet to achieve the same appreciation as other characters like Wario and Rosalina from what I noticed. I am not sure if Super Mario Bros. Wonder helped to elevate Daisy's reputation but I noticed that not everyone loved it.

Another thing I appreciate the roster is how Pauline is added in the wider roster, which is actually one of the best things since she was one of the first Mario characters but she didn't get her due for a long, long time. It's better late than never that her appearance in spinoffs are more frequent, now that she appeared in Golf and post-launch Kart 8 Deluxe.

I do commend Mario + Rabbids for differentiating the Rabbid versions of the Mario cast. If one were to only hear about the leaks, one might assume that the Rabbid versions are exaggerated versions of the Mario characters with a Rabbid twist, but they turned out to be distinctive so it's all good.

Anyway there are a few minor gripes in regards to the spinoffs:

• I think that for Mario Strikers, Rosalina should have been the post-addition character while Daisy should have been the initial character. As stated, Daisy didn't have the best reputation and since Rosalina is more beloved, making her a post-addition character is a better "shot in the arm" for that game compared to Daisy.
• Mario & Sonic could stand to have a couple more regular characters instead of using them as guests. Maybe like Toad and Toadette could be fine, while Sonic can have, I guess... Cream and Espio?
• The Mario RPGs once again played safe with playable characters. If not counting the series-limited ones (the Rabbids, Paper Mario partners, Mallow, Geno), they basically only used the primary Mario characters. I'll give them this: Yoshi being playable is surprisingly rare in RPGs that I have to commend them for doing this in one game.
• This is more of a personal disappointment, but it would've been nice if Waluigi were part of the main cast in WarioWare...

Mario Tennis Aces is like the only one where I thought the roster was even on par or superior with the equivalent games from the GCN generation. Such nice newcomers like Chain Chomp, Piranha Plant, Dry Bones, and we have welcome veterans like Paratroopa and Shy Guy. Even then, it's lacking Baby Mario, a character that Camelot themselves reintroduced into the spinoffs!

Not even Mario Kart, Mario Golf, and Mario Party fit the bill? I guess for Mario Kart, the lack of Paratroopa makes it subpar (the only Double Dash character to not be in 8 Deluxe)?

Thank you for reading.

 

[Lady]

The majority of the rosters are okay to me. But Mario and Sonic should add a few more characters. Mario can have Rosalina and Toad and Sonic can have Rouge and Cream?

 

[Doctor Welfare]

Eh, for me the spinoffs do a good enough job of covering different characters without convoluting the rosters too much, but I get that people want specific characters to show up more often

 

[Paper Mario]

I still believe Mario rosters are not at the level they should be in this era.

Super Sluggers is to me still the furthest they've gone in the direction I want, which is expansive coverage of the extended Marioverse. They've done a good job representing a lot of common mainline bosses, some who have been around a long time before becoming playable (like King Bob-Omb). And of course Pauline is hopefully here to stay now. We got Poochy in Mario Kart Tour, which I had hoped was the start of a new era of additions from across the Marioverse, but then Tour concluded new content shortly after

The fact that out of the extended Marioverse, the subseries with the most representation, Donkey Kong Country, still lacks its main villain even (who only appeared in Sluggers), both Wario series and the Mario RPGs having nothing (and before you ask, I don't count Baby Peach, I strongly doubt AlphaDream designed her and the concept of her was going to exist whether PIT did it first or not), E. Gadd still being missing and King Boo only ever showing up with his Large Boo With A Crown design (except in Tour where the real King Boo is treated as an alt), Toadsworth not being used anywhere at all much less playable (again, Baseball & Sluggers were his only playable appearances), I can't say I'm impressed by the coverage still.

While I don't think there is any shortage of mainline reps, Toadsworth is one I'll always support anyway because he feels like a retconned character at this point and given his prevalence in the M&L games after everything else abandoned him, plus his inspirations being RPG characters, he feels like an honorary RPG character to me, even if he still wouldn't officially count (and I still want a character that was actually created for those games). I don't think there is any reason for Mario spinoffs to hold back on characters that casual audiences might not recognize, because it would only be a net positive anyway, exposing them to new audiences many of which will buy their origin games as a result. I've been meaning to make a video on this actually, I have a lot to say on the matter but I think I've said enough in this thread.

 

[Dorayakiss]

As long as Daisy and Waluigi are playable in most of these it's all good.

Devotion to keeping all main cast to next game is okay. But for a new game you need to achive a higher bar as well. Otherwise that can just be called staying in the safe bubble.

I know several sport subjects did evolve with more creative system and better quality, but the samey rosters just ended up holding their back.

Mario + Rabbids

While I don't count it as a regular all-stars spin-off, if we try to apply other games' bar to it, the better question is why its DLC lineup didn't cover any Mario content.

Not even Mario Golf

feel really like interrupted in DLC plans. Birdo and Toadette are exclusive to each game despite they're obviously planned for the other one.

I get that people want specific characters to show up more often

As I said in the bottom, point is Nintendo did still give other popular characters spotlights outside the party games so that give their fans enough reason to complain.
If they don't even like the said characters, best solution would just be not using them in all kinds of occasions.

The fact that out of the extended Marioverse, the subseries with the most representation, Donkey Kong Country, still lacks its main villain even (who only appeared in Sluggers), both Wario series and the Mario RPGs having nothing

While I don't think there is any shortage of mainline reps, Toadsworth is one I'll always support anyway because he feels like a retconned character at this point and given his prevalence in the M&L games.

Technically Mario RPG OCs and Toadsworth are both not currently active main cast (even tho I love the RPG characters, in an unbiased view I still say they have to give main cast higher priority). Then since characters like Nabbit, King Boo and E.Gadd are factually main characters of the franchise, they deserve much more fair treat to match their roles,

I do think Toadsworth could had made it into the mobile titles easily if he still lives in the Nintendo Switch era. Also the whole movie plot is a huge middle finger for him.

The good thing about Sluggers is they try to differentiate Team Wario, Team Donkey and Team Yoshi rather than just Mario vs Bowser. Hope that they can keep the structure and add more sub-series characters in next round.

I don't think there is any reason for Mario spinoffs to hold back on characters that casual audiences might not recognize, because it would only be a net positive anyway, exposing them to new audiences many of which will buy their origin games as a result.

Yes, this is why I say not doing any promotion for new mainline titles is very dumb.

The majority of the rosters are okay to me. But Mario and Sonic should add a few more characters. Mario can have Rosalina and Toad and Sonic can have Rouge and Cream?

I think the point of Olympics is finding the strongest athelete. So the best excuse NIntendo and SEGA could give was that Toad always mean to be a supportor, not a challenger.

...... however it's not like both sides really tried to find actually strong people from respective worlds. The fact King KRool not even making any cameo in Olympics just makes the whole Olympics a joke.

Meanwhile I know both franchises didn't really have perfect gender ratio in main casts, but the companies seem to forget that realworld Olympics need to have same amount of guys and girls in the competition. So the lack of most recurring girls is sure very lame.
Especially when some countries have way more female golden medal winners, I don't think Mario's Olympics would really interest those citizens.

 

[Paper Mario]

I don't think being main cast should be a line drawn. What defines main cast is a blurry line anyway. If you're going to include characters that didn't debut in the main series, you really can't define an objective line. And Toadsworth DID debut in the main series so I think he counts as main cast even if they haven't used him in a while.

That said, every prominent Mario subseries that has characters unique to it should be fair game to pull characters from, ideally the fan-favorites. Every subseries has them.

 

[Mcmadness]

I think a mistake a lot of people do is use the word "representation"

These characters aren't representing anything. They are just characters that got picked because someone at the company was like "I like this, lets put in this" and don't have an encyclopedic knowledge of this utterly massive and extremely bloated franchise.

 

[Waluigi Time]

yes

 

[Dorayakiss]

I don't think being main cast should be a line drawn. What defines main cast is a blurry line anyway. If you're going to include characters that didn't debut in the main series, you really can't define an objective line. And Toadsworth DID debut in the main series so I think he counts as main cast even if they haven't used him in a while.

That said, every prominent Mario subseries that has characters unique to it should be fair game to pull characters from, ideally the fan-favorites. Every subseries has them.

I'm definitely with you about giving RPG characters some chance. I'm only speaking in Nintendo's logic that they tend to push mainline characters, so it's awful for none of the Nintendo Switch era characters ever appeared in a spinoff roster.

I agree that some RPG characters are popular enough to enter the hall of spinoffs and Nintendo should consider it just for the sake of $$$. It's not like every single character in official roster is more popular than them.

I think a mistake a lot of people do is use the word "representation"

Uhm.... I dunno. When a character makes it into the roster, people would naturally think about its game origin and references?

 

[Koopa con Carne]

Uhm.... I dunno. When a character makes it into the roster, people would naturally think about its game origin and references?

The 1% of the Mario fanbase that comprises hardcore lore enthusiasts, Marioverse-types, and those who spend their while talking about Mario on reddit, yes. Little Timmy who got Mario Kart last Christmas, no. I certainly didn't when I was first exposed to a Mario game.

 

[Ray Trace]

The 1% of the Mario fanbase that comprises hardcore lore enthusiasts, Marioverse-types, and those who spend their while talking about Mario on reddit, yes. Little Timmy who got Mario Kart last Christmas, no. I certainly didn't when I was first exposed to a Mario game.

I'm a person who plays CTR and I don't recognize anyone in the roster not named Crash, Coco, and Cortex, so I'd imagine the same type of indifference for the casual audience.

 

[Dorayakiss]

The 1% of the Mario fanbase that comprises hardcore lore enthusiasts, Marioverse-types, and those who spend their while talking about Mario on reddit, yes. Little Timmy who got Mario Kart last Christmas, no. I certainly didn't when I was first exposed to a Mario game.

It's more about what perspective you're trying to apply, I think?

The RPG case above definitely means the loyal Mario RPG fans' view, not Nintendo's view when they tried to push Mario characters to casual players. I just say when it comes to mainline, they're more exposed and more functional, but not necesarily polished.

I agree that even if the RPG characters are rich in story, casual players have to read them to know them first, so at the end of day they have to rely on their look, personality and brief intro.

Then as I said above, basically recent mainline and RPG characters are in a lose-lose tie as nobody really won a roster slot.

 

[Paper Mario]

I honestly think a character Little Timmy doesn't recognize being in Mario Kart would be harmless at worst, and expose Timmy to more Mario games if they get curious about who that character is at best. It won't cause the game not to be bought, as all the recognizable characters are still there.

The number of people who will actively choose not to buy the game because it has a character they don't recognize is surely less than the number of people who will be curious about who that character is + the number of fans of that character excited to see them. That's why I think there are only upsides to branching out into less safe territory. The people who wouldn't care, wouldn't care, their purchase was already either going to or not going to happen based on whether they want to play the game or the presence of Mario's main cast (who are not going anywhere).

 

[Doctor Welfare]

there are only upsides to branching out into less safe territory

That's right kids, being unsafe is good for you

The average kid won't mind having unfamiliar characters in a game, but they probably won't care about them either

 

[LeftyGreenMario]

Hell I'm familiar with the Mario franchise like a good family member I grew up with, and I have never particularly wanted or cared for exclusive Paper folk in Mario kart. Even E. Gadd I thought was basically long shot and people requested this character for decades.

Not even Mario Kart, Mario Golf, and Mario Party fit the bill? I guess for Mario Kart, the lack of Paratroopa makes it subpar (the only Double Dash character to not be in 8 Deluxe)?

Mario Kart doesn't have a solid switch installment in the technical sense

Mario Golf didn't get the updates I wanted from it vs Aces. Support for Super Rush died too quickly. I like the additions like King Bob omb, Toadette, Wiggler, Ninji, and Chargin Chuck but it felt a little more lacking vs Aces, and Super Rush wasn't built on a bedrock as good as Aces IMO.

Mario Party lacked Toad and Toadette who were mainstays (especially Toad) up until these games and it's a huge sour mark on the roster of those games

 

[Koopa con Carne]

Since I replied to this topic earlier, I might as well answer the question:

I'm pretty happy with the roster in a general sense. Mario Tennis Aces, Golf Rush, and the Booster Course Pass have gone beyond the bare minimum, introducing interesting playable folk such as Ninji, Chargin' Chuck, Chain Chomp, and Fire Piranha Plant. In Mario Kart 8, I pretty much only play as Funky, Diddy, and Wario (who was there from the Wii U installment). Mario Kart Tour added Poochy of all characters, and reintroduced Dixie Kong to Mario spin-offs after a long absence, though, sadly, neither made it into a Switch Mario spin-off in a playable role.

My hope is that this gets them devs' juices flowing to explore even deeper cuts in future games. I've been asking to play as K. Rool in Mario Kart for years now, and I believe an RPG sweetheart like Fawful or Vivian would be a racket as well. It's absolutely true that these characters aren't added to check a "series representation" box, but that doesn't mean the devs can't have a little fun looking through the wiki for a few offbeat fellas.

Also, get those crossover characters like Link and Inklings and especially Isabelle out of my Mario game, thanks.

 

[Mcmadness]

My thought is always this. There are hundreds of Mario characters, everyone and their mother can try and come up with some reason as to why such and such should be included.

At the end of the day it all comes down to who the dev teams pick and they like us have their own likes and dislikes that are just as valid.

 

[Wintertime Peach]

Mario Kart 8 Deluxe has the best roster from those games, but it took 9 years and many failed tries for the roster to become good:
They failed to make a good roster in base game MK8 Wii U (man, that roster sucked). Then the Wii U DLC felt like a slap in the face since we just got costumes, non Mario characters, and the worst possible choice for a returning veteran in Dry Bowser.
Then they failed again in base Mario Kart 8 Deluxe. It really feels like they took the lazy route with the characters that they added already having models in the game so they were easy additions, like King Boo (Boo model already in Twisted Mansion) and Dry Bones, who is already in Bone-Dry Dunes and 3DS Neo Bowser City (as Para-Bones).
But okay, in the end it turned out to be a very good roster and I am very happy with it.

Super Mario Party has the second best roster out of all the Mario Party games, with Mario Party 8 having the best. I prefer 8's because Birdo.
In this game, the only character from the top row that I really like is Peach. The rest of the heros/good characters are overrated, so I had to group her with random baddies in River Survival. My favorite team was Peach, Goomba, Monty Mole, and Boo. Pom Pom was also an interesting choice, and I hope it's not her one and only time being playable.

Mario Tennis Aces did have a quality roster by the end, but I'd still say that I prefer 8 Deluxe's because I like the babies, Pink Gold Peach, Koopalings, and Peachette more than any characters exclusive to Tennis Aces.

I don't play Mario & Sonic anymore but the fact that it's been the same 20 characters since the second game in the series is eh, and also lame that the 'newcomers' are limited to 1 event each.

Mario Strikers: Battle League had a laughable starting roster, but in the end I'd say that it was all right for a Mario Strikers game. At least they added Birdo.

Mario Golf: Super Rush's roster...NO.
It sucks. No Birdo, and characters like Toadette, Shy Guy, and Koopa should not be DLC, they should already be in the base game. Ninji is an interesting addition, though.

 

[Daniel Dyce]

I'm a person who plays CTR and I don't recognize anyone in the roster not named Crash, Coco, and Cortex, so I'd imagine the same type of indifference for the casual audience.

Yeah but you get really hyped everytime Ripper Roo shows up right?

 

[Ray Trace]

I'm a Nash and Iron Checkpoint Crate guy my man.

 

[winstein]

Hell I'm familiar with the Mario franchise like a good family member I grew up with, and I have never particularly wanted or cared for exclusive Paper folk in Mario kart. Even E. Gadd I thought was basically long shot and people requested this character for decades.

This sorts of put into perspective those who requested for Geno, who only shows up in Super Mario RPG as a major character. I do not think that Geno is in particularly high demand if referring to the Mario series, but it's funny how that characters is in high demand for Smash fighter (even though I don't necessarily agree that he would be a practical choice).

Mario Kart doesn't have a solid switch installment in the technical sense

Mario Golf didn't get the updates I wanted from it vs Aces. Support for Super Rush died too quickly. I like the additions like King Bob omb, Toadette, Wiggler, Ninji, and Chargin Chuck but it felt a little more lacking vs Aces, and Super Rush wasn't built on a bedrock as good as Aces IMO.

Mario Party lacked Toad and Toadette who were mainstays (especially Toad) up until these games and it's a huge sour mark on the roster of those games

If you put it that way, yeah I can see how Mario Kart Live: Home Circuit has a subpar roster, when Mario and Luigi both have the same characters in relays. They could've given Luigi different characters! Like Daisy, Toadette, and I guess Birdo, but nope... I am not sure if that's what you mean, though.

I initially thought you were comparing to the Gamecube installments for those games, so Mario Golf Super Rush vs. Mario Golf Toadstool Tour, but seems like you were comparing Super Rush to Mario Tennis Aces instead. I do agree that Tennis Aces have a solid roster when comparing to Mario Power Tennis, but I personally think Super Rush isn't too shabby when comparing to Toadstool Tour, especially when the game is deeper mechanically for every character.

Mario Party I can agree that the lack of certain characters are a dealbreaker. I understand the feeling, for I thought that the lack of Waluigi in Mario Kart 7 is my personal dealbreaker.

Thank you for reading.