Unpopular opinions about the Mario series

BBQ Turtle

Crazy sponsors lady.
Wiki Administrator
Awards Committee
Heck yeah! There's a market out there for other characters. They should be well aware of it. And heck, it's not just the characters that are limited, I really want Mario Party shirts, Mario sports games shirts, DDR Mario Mix shirts. I've seen only basic Mario platforming (mostly retro stuff like NES, Super Mario Bros. 3, Super Mario World, maybe one Odyssey shirt?) and the very, very occasional Mario Kart. I did saw some really neat Mario shirts at Box Lunch but everything else just seems to be way too small for me, too basic, or NES style.

I'd buy these sweet designs like these if they weren't just Red Bubble items, but actually found in whatever geek store I walk into.

Even Red Bubble isn't 100% giving me designs from other games but they still have a lot of tight stuff in there (but be warned, there's some really dumb/distastefull stuff in there too that'll make you look like an asshole with a poor sense of humor if you wear them, so, really, no point to buying those in the first place),



Only thing I'm hoping is that they're all original designs because I'd feel bad if they weren't and the person who made the art doesn't see that money.

But maybe I'm looking in the wrong place all together, but I just can't help feeling disappointed when I go into GameStop, Hot Topic, etc. and find nothing I really like.
Yeah, we rarely see anything that isn't generic Mario, platformers or Mario Kart either. We've actually managed to find a fair bit for Mario Kart though, over the years we've found all sorts from badges to bedsheets, clothing, tracks, and a big remote control Bowser. You can really tell that there's demand for other characters though, there's a toy shop by us that have really upped their Mario game recently on the figure lines, and it's always the rarer enemies and characters that go first and just leave the plain Marios. Most of the Mario shirts I have are from Primark, but they go in fits and starts so it's random if you find any. And yeah, I hope that isn't stolen art on those shirts because they are really nice designs. It's hard to know if they are though, as someone in my computer science class has had several pieces of her art stolen and put up on Red Bubble without her knowing.
 

Ribbon

Fairy of Ripple Star
Poll Committee
Unpopular shit incoming

-Super Paper Mario is my favorite Mario RPG game. Then again, I like every Paper Mario game (except Sticker Star. Yes, I like Color Splash). I also loved Partners in Time (and was butthurt it didn't get the remake treatment at first. Seeing the unfortunate news involving AlphaDream, though, I understand why they just skipped to Inside Story). I guess I'm not really bothered by dark things in Mario games, lol.

I thought SPM was decent, but also really overrated. The story and setting felt too un-Mario and the gameplay was just mediocre and repetitive. It's my least favorite Mario RPG overall. I also think Partners in Time (and also Sticker Star) are some of the most underrated Mario games of all time.

-I prefer Super Mario World's Mario and Luigi sprites to Superstar Saga's (SS still has my second favorite Bros sprites)

Don't have much of an opinion here.

-I don't really mind story in Mario games. Like, it doesn't need it, but I wouldn't complain if the next 2D Super Mario game had some minor shakeup to the "kidnap Peach, git her back and beat Bowser for that victory dinner royale" formula. Like obviously, it shouldn't come before making the game fun, but I think that, along with maybe some new types of worlds (Like a Space World) and some character from the vast family of Mario apart from Mario, Luigi, Toads, Peach, Yoshi, and Bowser/his children would go a long way in making "New Super Mario Bros 5: Newest of All Time" (or whatever the next New Super Mario Bros game is called) feel less samey, more than adding an occasional new powerup would anyways. (This is unpopular within my friend group)

I definitely agree with this, Mario can work with story. Gameplay definitely comes first, but a good story would be the cherry on top.

-I actually care about Mario less for it's gameplay and much more about it's characters and especially it's setting.

I'll have to respectfully disagree with this one, Mario was always primarily gameplay to me. Kirby is that series I love for characters and setting, not Mario.

-I think seeing the Koopalings as Boss fights in a 3D Mario game has tons of potential and I want to see that.

This should absolutely be a thing and should have happened a while ago.

-Super Mario 3D Land's final Bowser fight is one of my favorite Bowser boss fights in any game, as well as one of my favorite boss fights period

That one was epic, but Meowser in 3D World is my personal favorite (for the platformers at least)

-I liked Super Mario 64 DS more than the original overall (though I preferred plenty of things in the original as well)

This is one of those "unpopular" opinions that's actually objectively correct and if anyone disagrees I will very politely and respectfully say "no u" and go to your house and kill you in your sleep

Maybe I'll do more when I'm not a lazy moron
 

Shy Guy on Wheels

Hornet from Daytona USA for Smash
My biggest issue with references to the NES games is that they're so common, and they're often the only thing that ever gets referenced. At this point they've lost any and all meaning.
 

winstein

Justice is not limited, it is a universal quality
Perhaps the want of a more engaging story in Mario could be why the RPG games (and its characters) are held in higher regard compared to the other spin-offs like Kart, Party and the Sports games. In a way, the RPG characters and story made a stronger impact than even characters from Super Mario (ex: Broodals, Nabbit and Sprixie Princess). This is despite the fact that the RPG games have a lesser sales reach compared to something like Mario & Sonic or Mario Party. This is evidenced by a few things: how much fan art is inspired by the RPGs, the much louder vocal discontent from the recent Paper Mario games*, more visible request for Smash Bros to have a character from an RPG like Paper Mario and oddly Geno** and overall the more positive inspiration that has often been mentioned.

* Best evidenced by how much "Fail Awards" votes anything involving Sticker Star got.
** A character starting in spin-offs is usually cited as a reason against making them playable

I never cared much for the NES Mario. It even annoys me how glorified it is.The visual art & gameplay started to be good with the SNES. And then the visual art got choppy for the entire N64 & GBC generation, and finally got back to being good again in GBA & GC,
and then kept getting better with every generation.
In a way, I started to appreciate Donkey Kong (arcade) references because of the overflowing Super Mario Bros. references, whereas I was not exactly thrilled by Donkey Kong references before that. At one time, Nintendo outright never acknowledged that Mario started from Donkey Kong at all, and when I brought this up, most people here either didn't mind that or they outright prefer that Super Mario Bros. should be the starting point of acknowledgement. People even mistake the Super Mario Bros anniversary as the anniversary of the character.

Therefore it's my unpopular opinion that the original Donkey Kong should by right be acknowledged as a part of Mario history because it's a very instrumental game for Nintendo (you know, because Mario started here) and not something to brush off. It's great to see that they are coming around on this.

Thank you for reading.
 

Glowsquid

Shine Sprite
Forum Moderator
Wiki Bureaucrat
Core 'Shroom Staff
The whole meme that Wario was big dick chad badass until Warioware bad shovelware minigame compilation for casuals emasculated him is dumb as shit. Even disresgarding that the Wario Land games and their supporting material have plenty of goofy slaptstick at Wario's expense and things like Wario scratching his butt and shaking his derrière at the camera, it's like

his name is Wario

he looks like this



It's like calling Bugs Bunny a badass.
 

Mcmadness

The idiot who puts things in the wrong board.
You can look stupid and still be a badass.

That being said, Wario was always a goof. Sure in the Land games (and world) he could beat the crap out of a lot of people, it didn't change that he was as purposely unpleasant as they could make him.
 

MetaWeegee

Dancing is Forbidden!
I get preferring Mario's but Luigi's sprite in in SMW was literally green Mario
I was talking about the sprites Luigi used in the All-Stars Version of SMW.
The whole meme that Wario was big dick chad badass until Warioware bad shovelware minigame compilation for casuals emasculated him is dumb as shit. Even disresgarding that the Wario Land games and their supporting material have plenty of goofy slaptstick at Wario's expense and things like Wario scratching his butt and shaking his derrière at the camera, it's like

his name is Wario

he looks like this



It's like calling Bugs Bunny a badass.
He was always a goof, but he's still a strong AF motherfucker who rams through people and brick like there's nothing to it, piledrives dinosaurs, and has some killer rides. I don't see why he can't be considered badass in addition to a goof, they aren't really exclusive.
 
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Wicked Clown-nak

Too Fat to Release
On the subject of merchandise. I'd absolutely kill for M&L or Paper Mario merch, especially of the characters that don't appear in the other games. Sadly it's unlikelier than ever now that M&L's developer is bankrupt and Paper Mario seems to have retired all its OCs. But if I was in charge of a merch company I'd most certainly reach out to Nintendo to try and make that a reality. I just love the characters so much and hate that I can't flaunt that love with anything official other than a stylus that went missing and finding another is rare -_-
 

Redshift

Enjoying dinners at 9:00 PM
people who say wario is just a farting goofball in wariowear (wario doesn't even fart in wariowear iirc) never read the game's instruction booklets, see him act like badass in some of his themed microgames or see him at least try to act like a badass as wario-man.

even within wario world, like his title of his story in the manual literally says "FROM RICHES TO RAGS" how is that not goofy

On the subject of merchandise. I'd absolutely kill for M&L or Paper Mario merch, especially of the characters that don't appear in the other games. Sadly it's unlikelier than ever now that M&L's developer is bankrupt and Paper Mario seems to have retired all its OCs. But if I was in charge of a merch company I'd most certainly reach out to Nintendo to try and make that a reality. I just love the characters so much and hate that I can't flaunt that love with anything official other than a stylus that went missing and finding another is rare -_-
well i've paddled with the unofficial, fan-made market to get merc of my made-up characters and i can't say i am disappointed, if at all, of what i've got. even someone like waluigi doesn't even get much official merchandise, so many of merch lines are just composed of "mario peach toad luigi bowser yoshi" and it's boring to buy those same characters over and over and over again, just sometimes in karts, sometimes as as knex, etc etc etc.

i mean i guess it's good that my twin can get a 389074398398th mario for her collection but i won't be content unless i stick with the unofficial market.

(stealth want more Baby Luigi merch at least Baby Mario got Mario Kart 8 merch but Baby Luigi skimped out like usual)
 

Princess Mario

✨Mushroom Kingdom's fabulously glittery plumber✨
The whole meme that Wario was big dick chad badass until Warioware bad shovelware minigame compilation for casuals emasculated him is dumb as shit. Even disresgarding that the Wario Land games and their supporting material have plenty of goofy slaptstick at Wario's expense and things like Wario scratching his butt and shaking his derrière at the camera, it's like

his name is Wario

he looks like this



It's like calling Bugs Bunny a badass.
It's also important to remember the context Wario was created under. He's an "evil" Mario. Mario's series is known primarily for being cute, cartoony, weird, light-hearted. Wario has been always a comic relief character first and then a physically strong character next. Even his second most prominent trait, his strength, is juxtaposed with his obesity, cartoonish appearance with the silly nose and pointy shoes and pointy ears; and poor hygiene to amplify absurdity. Strength alone, too, can be added to Wario's comic relief as absurd slapstick. There's also the unbinding, flexible nature of the Mario series when it comes to character traits and personality (with usually one or two traits established after a few games), so one artist's view of Wario might be different from another. Even in fans, they'll disagree how Wario "should" be. You guys see him as some sort of "badass" but I think he's some rich arrogant loser, the type that'll drive fast and cut you off on freeways, a thug who'd shove people just for a black friday Xbox, the guy who'll never get relationships with anyone (and I can't say if he's content with that or not but it seems like he doesn't care?), a very poor sport, a horrible, selfish teammate who somehow gets the maximum cooperation from his subordinates; and a guy who'll complain about things if he can't get things his way. It's not too far off the mark but I wouldn't call Wario necessarily a "badass" based on my own definition.

As others pointed out, being silly and being strong aren't mutually exclusive and it's actually common to see those two play hand in hand. Absurd strength is a common component of comedy; it's a *bedrock* of not only Wario, but Wario's parent series Mario as well, where Mario's absurdity is a David-Goliath relationship while Wario derives absurdity with a more extreme contrast between physical fitness and strength and elements of anti-hero.

It's just a weird argument that WarioWare is some linear "progression" from Wario Land rather than an independent series with its own set of rules, context. I'm not saying it's entirely independent; perhaps WarioWare has influenced Wario Land later, but I'm sure Wario Land has influenced Wario to a large extent, and maybe WarioWare has just focused more on the money-making and the weird absurdity of Wario, but hasn't dropped Wario's thuggish nature. Wario Land, however, HAS made that bed of Wario being "weird". You probably can't blame WarioWare for exploring concepts that Wario Land has established. I've already talked about Wario's design and the context he arose from, but the enemies too are very weird (one boss from the first Wario Land game is, I quote from Mayro Kiwi: "a giant stone head whose fighting style revolves around breaking blocks with his tongue", a boss from the second one is a snake from Wario's basement that can turn Wario into an egg and a basketball-playing bunny). The powerups are also weird, when you got drunken Wario, zombie Wario, Fatter Wario; and these require hitting him.

The game context is also very important. When Wario is adventuring, he needs his feats of strength to actually power through his enemies. In the minigame compilations, he can't exactly hit people or bust rocks, and he's not really in a terrible amount of microgames.

I can't think of much games where Wario has been portrayed as very contrary to what Wario is. Brawl comes into mind as maybe the most diversionary but this is probably just another interpretation of Wario. There might have been some influence in what WarioWare: Touched! has done to Wario too; the "real" Wario is kind of a loser who is in constant discomfort. He starts off as dropping his Gameboy Advances (though he beats up a Sewer Guru which just shows he's still a thug). He gorges on sweets, suffers from cavities. Wario prior to being Wario-Man is seen all lame and sick before eating a rotten garlic. Wario-Man is just... pathetic. You see him go on a work-out routine that immediately tires him, and while he does break some undefined walls, he tries to stop a train and just gets smacked away. Finally, Wario gets beaten up by the Sewer Guru. I haven't played other WarioWares as extensively as this one, but Wario faced a lot of punishment in Touched! (and it's hilarious) even in the microgames.

And never has this felt "off" from Wario's schtick, as I believe he's comic relief. He's supposed to be sometimes hilariously pathetic. Wario isn't exactly immune to it in the Wario platformers either, as he gets a statue stolen by Mario, the Bottomless Coin Sack stolen by Captain Syrup, Wario World's story prefaces with comic reversion "From Riches to Rags". Wario Land's entire set up entirely eschews traditional "be a handsome man to save the princess and the mystical creatures" and emphasizes the "get rich along the way", which one could call almost a satire/parody (?) of these stories.

Anyway, sue me; I just wrote an essay about Wario, of all things.


My biggest issue with references to the NES games is that they're so common, and they're often the only thing that ever gets referenced. At this point they've lost any and all meaning.
I can't argue if the NES games "lost meaning" but I think marketers leave out a younger audience that didn't grow up on those games. NES is a major milestone in video game history, and people that were born to it are in their 30's and they just seem to be an immediately easier demographic to reach since older people probably remember the milestones better. Nostalgia marketing can be saturated however, and that's what I have a problem with. I don't even think video game merchandising in of itself is saturated, not where I am where I think "saturation" better applies to merch I don't care for Marvel and Star Wars. Just that within that smallish market, it's a lot of NES stuff and it's tough sometimes to find merch I like. Maybe I'm just a minority demographic, so I turn to other markets.

Perhaps the want of a more engaging story in Mario could be why the RPG games (and its characters) are held in higher regard compared to the other spin-offs like Kart, Party and the Sports games. In a way, the RPG characters and story made a stronger impact than even characters from Super Mario (ex: Broodals, Nabbit and Sprixie Princess). This is despite the fact that the RPG games have a lesser sales reach compared to something like Mario & Sonic or Mario Party. This is evidenced by a few things: how much fan art is inspired by the RPGs, the much louder vocal discontent from the recent Paper Mario games*, more visible request for Smash Bros to have a character from an RPG like Paper Mario and oddly Geno** and overall the more positive inspiration that has often been mentioned.

* Best evidenced by how much "Fail Awards" votes anything involving Sticker Star got.
** A character starting in spin-offs is usually cited as a reason against making them playable

In a way, I started to appreciate Donkey Kong (arcade) references because of the overflowing Super Mario Bros. references, whereas I was not exactly thrilled by Donkey Kong references before that. At one time, Nintendo outright never acknowledged that Mario started from Donkey Kong at all, and when I brought this up, most people here either didn't mind that or they outright prefer that Super Mario Bros. should be the starting point of acknowledgement. People even mistake the Super Mario Bros anniversary as the anniversary of the character.

Therefore it's my unpopular opinion that the original Donkey Kong should by right be acknowledged as a part of Mario history because it's a very instrumental game for Nintendo (you know, because Mario started here) and not something to brush off. It's great to see that they are coming around on this.

Thank you for reading.
I think the MaRPG has better influence on the audience because of the more apparent storytelling and maybe more engaging single player. But you did sum up pretty well the reasons for MaRPG's appeals. I'm probably just not that audience so maybe that's why I find it sometimes difficult to relate.

It doesn't help that Donkey Kong is regarded as part of the Donkey Kong series when I think it's more of a trunk that split into two. It's kind of its own series, really. Doesn't seem accurate that there are spinoffs of it or something, but I do remember when people said the Mario series and Donkey Kong Countries are spinoffs of Donkey Kong.

On the subject of merchandise. I'd absolutely kill for M&L or Paper Mario merch, especially of the characters that don't appear in the other games. Sadly it's unlikelier than ever now that M&L's developer is bankrupt and Paper Mario seems to have retired all its OCs. But if I was in charge of a merch company I'd most certainly reach out to Nintendo to try and make that a reality. I just love the characters so much and hate that I can't flaunt that love with anything official other than a stylus that went missing and finding another is rare -_-
Yeah, I think the market is there but I still think it's not big enough for official licensing outside from minor swag from pre-release promotions. Free-lance, however, is still a profitable venture for those involved. Might be more expensive though, but it'll feel more special than something mass-produced and mass-marketed.
 

Mcmadness

The idiot who puts things in the wrong board.
The guys named Chad are the Chads.
 

Ribbon

Fairy of Ripple Star
Poll Committee
Pink Gold Peach does not deserve the hate she gets. Sure, she's pointless, but a lot of other Mario Kart clones are equally pointless (see Metal Mario, Cat Peach, Tanooki Mario, Dry Bowser, Baby Daisy, Daisy in general, etc), and pointlessness in itself is not a reason to justify hating a character. She doesn't disregard or retcon anything about Peach, she's just Peach with a Gold Flower.

Unlike PGP, clones like Baby Rosalina and Gold Luigi have an actual reason to dislike them (the former for directly contradicting Rosalina's original backstory, and the latter for retconning one of Luigi's few unique power-up forms).
 

Princess Mario

✨Mushroom Kingdom's fabulously glittery plumber✨
Metal Mario isn't as equally pointless. He had his role of being a middle-frame heavy-weight and had playable status before as well as a prominent role in Super Smash Bros. as a midboss. I mean, it's not super duper important, but it's there.

I think Pink Gold Peach is still closer to Baby Daisy in that she's a counterpart of an existing character maybe to add a little bit of an answer to Metal Mario,

I think Baby Rosalina can still be dismissed outright because she didn't hurt anyone too, she's just a filler character. Gold Luigi has also no impact on Silver Luigi's existence either.
 

Redshift

Enjoying dinners at 9:00 PM
Honey Queen deserved to return in Mario Kart 8. She is a great character to introduce to the Mario Kart series.
 

Ribbon

Fairy of Ripple Star
Poll Committee
Metal Mario isn't as equally pointless. He had his role of being a middle-frame heavy-weight and had playable status before as well as a prominent role in Super Smash Bros. as a midboss. I mean, it's not super duper important, but it's there.

I think Pink Gold Peach is still closer to Baby Daisy in that she's a counterpart of an existing character maybe to add a little bit of an answer to Metal Mario,

I think Baby Rosalina can still be dismissed outright because she didn't hurt anyone too, she's just a filler character. Gold Luigi has also no impact on Silver Luigi's existence either.
I personally have no strong opinions on Baby Rosalina, but I can at least understand the reason behind her hate. Gold Luigi is one I dislike simply because he truly has no reason to exist and only does because the P&D devs were too lazy to find out that he doesn't.

Metal Mario is probably the least pointless of all the clones I mentioned and has developed several distinctions from regular Mario since his debut as a clone, but I did feel the need to mention him nevertheless due to being another power-up based clone.
 

Wicked Clown-nak

Too Fat to Release
Robo Mario should've filled the role Metal Mario has. Could fill the exact same niche but with the added bonus of a more distinct design and a clearer origin (due to being an E. Gadd invention)

Why this character was left to rot baffles me.
 
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