Pokémon Mafia 2 - Sign-Up Thread

btw revin had chosen his roleplay before the roles were sent out, and I had already locked in who the roles were going to at that point… I think he had some divine vision that he was going to be mafia lol
 
Hi! Thanks for letting me play the game and thank you so much for understanding my life situation that unfortunately led to my early dropout, and, I will say, good game from the townies!

Anyway, from a casual player PoV, an updated list of roles pinned here would be a good idea. While I was playing the game doing some research on the roles (because on how the late-game turned out, roleclaiming looked to be crucial in order to not get eliminated on the mafia side, plus Revin wanted us to strategize fakeclaims to counter the town doing real ones, but I never got any indication to who or what I should roleclaim, or pretend what powers I even used should that been called into question by other townies: ie Blof, what did you do on Night 1, 2, 3? would have been led to such an easy lynch towards me because I can't answer that question without knowing what to sa), the main problem is exactly what roles do I have to roleclaim? This is also an addenum to Fanta's earlier post on how rolemadness like this favors the townies), I did stumble across this old thread right here which does list the roles (that's the one Ninelevendo was talking about in his early post?) but because it was so old and tucked away in an archive board, I didn't know how relevant it would be in today's atmosphere. I don't know if there are such thing as roles entirely made up for a specific game or not, I just know the most vanilla ones (cop, doctor, godfather).

Sidenote but why did old mafias ban "metagaming" when that's something that's literally impossible to do lol

As Fanta said, people back in the day have the idea that playing mafia means that everything has to be self-contained within the game only, when that's actually impossible, just from the nature of context of our psyche outside the game. Almost every post you make in mafia is calculated if you're a good player, even when it comes down to timing and scheduling. This lends itself to a variety of playstyles to try to mix it all up but all of this originates from an individual's psyche, how they react to things at the moment, how they react when there is pressure on them: everybody has strengths and weaknesses regardless if they are playing the game or not, and the best players know each other, how they pull the strings, and what they are prone to do, what they like doing, what they don't like, if they like taking risks or playing safe. Since your aim is to win, you have to use everything at your disposal, lying and deception is such a huge part of it that even playing stupid when you know what's going on is actually a viable strategy to keeping targets off your back.

In fact, I would argue that metagaming IS playing mafia, almost every single decision everyone makes is based off some form of metagaming. This is why in mafia, people love to shoot down the experienced players, this is also why that in the earliest nights, I was leaning to kill the more experienced players, because I know they've been in the most games, they'd have experience on how both townies and mafia think, they're the most dangerous players, and I know they're the most likely to drive things forward and win. I still remember in one of my mafia times, Fun with Despair killed me first because I was "extremely stubborn" and I wouldn't "back down from a vote", because he knew how I was as a person and my tendencies, despite me not even doing much at all in that game!
 
This is why 'no mass-roleclaiming' is a rule. However, it's a bad rule that is ill-defined and impossible to enforce. What is a mass roleclaim? 3 claims? What if the Mafia just takes all the claim slots with fakeclaims? Your only way around it is to have a bunch of Vanilla characters in the mix, or as other folks suggested, have some roles un-assigned.

I kinda disagree with the host providing fakeclaim cards - the Mafia can use their imagination.

I agree that the "no mass roleclaiming" rule has always seemed kinda dumb and like a band-aid attempt to fix the larger issue of it being incredibly difficult for the mafia players to come up with good roleclaims after all the innocent players reveal their roles (which is basically what ended up happening this game), however I don't entirely understand why you're against the idea of giving mafia players a list of some unused rules to work with for fake claims. Are you able to elaborate on your reasoning?

Having an open role pool with some of the roles being unused gives the mafia team at least something to work with, but still makes it very difficult for them openly claim a role without basically just gambling on a role and potentially being counterclaimed by the player that actually has that role, which leads into a 50/50 situation that is very disadvantageous to the mafia side. Mafia can get around this by roleclaiming late after most of the other roles have already claimed, but it casts suspicion on the players who roleclaim last and skews things towards the innocent side regardless.

imo giving the mafia team a small list of "bluff" roles equal to the number of mafia players sounds like the perfect counter-measure, at least in role madness games, since it completely de-incentivises early game mass roleclaims (as it would result in the innocent side revealing all of their powerful roles, allowing the mafia to freely pick off whatever they want) and allowing the mafia to claim something at any point in the game without immediately being counterclaimed (and the option to roleclaim something entirely different is still there). I think it's worth trying in a future game at the very least.

At any rate I'll still try and get a mafia role list going as it still will help newer players have a point of reference, especially with making fake claims if someone decides to host another role madness game without providing bluffs or an open rolepool. (and yeah the old list that Blof mentioned has a lot of irrelevant roles to sift through that wouldn't get used in the current format)
 
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