Toughest Mario Level and why it's so hard

Oh look, a "I hate this Mario level thread"! I have so many levels I hate too! I can only imagine what stuff is going to get discussed here.

....

What's breathing down my neck?!???
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Some of the Mario Party games where you have to mashing A and I just can't keep up with the COMs. I think there was a specific minigame about hammer pounding?
 
My dear boy, have you heard the legends of Champion's Road from Super Mario 3D World? Or how in order to technically 100% the game, you have to clear it five times? That s*** is brutal, and I consider myself an expert at the platformer Mario games!
 
The first problem with threads like this comes down to what is and is not considered a "level" between different kinds of games. Is a Mario Kart track a "level" in the same way a 2D platform course is a "level"? What about a Mario Party mini-game vs. a 3D platform world? Are chapters in the RPGs "levels"?

The second problem is: Even if you narrow it down to "hardest 2D level" or "hardest RPG chapter" or something like that, there's still a pretty large pool of potential reasons why they're so hard, to the point I'm not sure I can fairly pick one of each.

Sometimes a 2D level is hard because of a bullshit gimmick, sometimes it's hard because of one specific part, sometimes it's hard because it goes on for way too long. and sometimes it's hard because it actively goes against how the game works normally. Are all of these even on the same table?
 
Valley Fortress is my favorite genuinely challenging level, especially near the end where you have to time your jumps very well, against the Skewers. The Skewers are more deadly in the original version of the game than the remake, but I still like how many Skewers this level has lol.

Yoshi's Island special levels are very challenging too. Yeah some of them are bullshit (I hate See Poochy Run from Yoshi's New Island) but I thought Ride the Blarrgwich and All Aboard the Terrain Train were fun levels despite being difficult to 100% in. All Aboard the Terrain Train does become significantly easier when you know where you can get the red coins however...and they fortunately did not put any red coins in the third part of the level excluding the Fly Guys carrying them if I recall correctly.
 
This thread brings up an interesting question in my mind; people who like Sunshine always seem to disagree on whether the worst level is the Pachinko Machine or the Poison River. Personally, I'm more of a Pachinko Machine hater, but it's always interesting to see how many people think the Poison River is worse.
 
Pachinko Machine seems to be workable as long as you don't input anything when Mario gets launched from the trampoline, iirc. The poison river, though, the level itself is not too hard, it's just accessing it is a demonstration of stunning incompetent design. You had to board a slow boat due to Yoshi dissolving in water, and if you miss a red coin in the level itself and take the pipe exit, which warps you SOMEHOW not to the entrance of the stage but in the Isle Delfino main plaza, you have to do that whole process all over.

My own beloathed level is the roller coaster one because it requires precision aiming when the way that shooting is designed is far from precise. Sure, it works fine shooting crap at Mecha Bowser, but NOT with balloon targets. You also fail the mission, you die for some reason.

The Secret of the Dirty Lake red coins was just plain difficult but that may be just from my experience using the Rocket Nozzle. IDK.
 
i havent really tried either pachinko or hte lilypad lmao but i will always repeat the goopy inferno was an absolute pain and made me cry (like many things in sunshine tbf