BigBoom1946
Extremely Eloquent Extraterrestrial
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I'll sign up.
Rogues in Rogueport 2: The Uprising - Mafia Game - Lounge Thread
- Thread starter Diamant
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- Ninja Squid
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- #27
We have officially reached the maximum number of sign ups! 
In the meantime, I am going to finish preparations for this game and I will take the time to check on a starting date too (which I should be able to announce relatively soon). Stay tuned!
In the meantime, I am going to finish preparations for this game and I will take the time to check on a starting date too (which I should be able to announce relatively soon). Stay tuned!
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- #28
Ready to learn the secret behind the Dark Crystal Star? Will you prevent the ultimate conquest and unmask the traitors within your ranks?
Rogues in Rogueport 2: The Uprising will starts on !
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- #29
Just going to put the announcement here too for forum dwellers:
The Role Cards will be delivered tomorrow on February 20th. The Game Thread will also open tomorrow!
The official start date will still be on February 22nd and will serve as the start of the Day 1 phase.
From this point on, this thread will serve as the Lounge Thread.
Thank you!
The Role Cards will be delivered tomorrow on February 20th. The Game Thread will also open tomorrow!
The official start date will still be on February 22nd and will serve as the start of the Day 1 phase.
From this point on, this thread will serve as the Lounge Thread.
Thank you!
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- Ninja Squid
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- #30
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- He/Him |Boo1268
As our Heros Dock off sore to uncover the mysterys in this seedy town a purple owl comes by and drops off a Creepy looking jack-n-the box with a simple "Who" and flys away!
So.....Who wants to open the box?
So.....Who wants to open the box?
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ClawgripFan9001
Pirate Crustacean
- MarioWiki
- ClawgripFan9001
That jingle describes better than words ever could how unfortunate that loss was for the investigators.
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- MarioWiki
- Hooded Pitohui
Four Years And Some Months Ago...
???: ...so... just what are, uh, ento... entisai... entosaiwe...? They're basically ghosts?
???: No and yes, curious one. Spirits of the departed, they are. That is the "yes". However, entosaiwe has particular connotation which is not captured by words such as spirit or specter. "Wraith" may be more appropriate a translation, but I settle simply for "vengeful spirits". Entosaiwe are souls which feel they were cheated in life, lingering that they may take vengeance upon the living.
???: And your mom wanted them to possess you?!
???: I answer the same. Had she her way, and yes, the entosaiwe would have entered my mind just as her own. The ritual is not one of forced possession, however. Its completion requires a willing invitation extended to the entosaiwe. Had I not departed, she would have expected I bid them into my mind, just as she in her youth, and her mother before her. I, though, preferred to retain full control of my faculties.
???: Eugh, I was always warned Rogueport was a den of criminals, but I never knew they were that bad. They're even worse than everyone said... No wonder you snuck out. Thieves, killers, fraudsters... Who could stand living with those crooks?
???: Curious One.
???: Y-Yeah?
???: The tongue is as a blade. Take care that in thoughtless lashing, yours does not draw blood.
???: Huh? D-Did... did I say something wrong?
Alexis: The crooks of which you speak are as family to me. That I have long since departed from the port and its sewers does not sever our bond. Rogueport is, and forever shall be, my home, no matter where I may roam.
Lily: O-Oh, uh, I didn't mean to insult anyone! I just... Weren't you always getting robbed? Or swindled? Or having to pay off mobsters?
Alexis: On rare occassion, yes, but not as often as you might suspect. Most trouble resulted from our surfacing at the wrong moment. So long as we dwelt underground, few bothered us. When even we emerged on the surface, peaceful were the bulk of our days. Ills befell us only when we carelessly emerged during eruptions of active conflict between the syndicate in the west and the gang in the east.
Lily: So, what, the rest of the time, everyone ignored each other?
Alexis: Not "ignored", no. Largely, we watched over one another. At times, yes, a resident would swindle another. Mostly the overdwellers. Fierce competition for freshly-arrived marks kept most from growing friendly. Some acquired debts, while others became ruthless lenders. Yet beneath the jostling, a shared understanding emerged. Most did not live in Rogueport by choice. When a denizen fell ill, or failed to collect from a tourist and could afford no food, charity among the crooked provided for them. The enforcers spread word, and those they served paused debt collection. None were to strike the ill, lest they be made a pariah, and one could count always on the thieves to deliver pilfered foodstuffs and medication.
Lily: That's... weirdly noble. You're sure these were thieves? I just... I've never heard of a noble thief.
Alexis: Then perhaps you should seek out more thieves. You judge them crooked before even knowing their methods and aims. Not all who proclaim themselves thieves are wicked. You should endeavor to hear their deeds. You have time yet to change your views, youthful one.
Lily: ...maybe. I mean, I can give it a shot, right? You're a lot nicer than I thought an assassin for hire wo-
Alexis: Sellsword.
Lily: -uh, right. Sorry.
Alexis: Think little of it. Were killings exclusively my domain, I would not shy from calling myself an assassin. What cause is there to disguise my profession?
Lily: You might be able to stay in one place longer.
Alexis: Perhaps so, but I care not for such duplicity. Those who feign friendship to the naive are often more wicked than the forthrightly crooked. Take care that you give wide berth to such types.
Lily: Are you saying I'm naive?
Alexis: I am, but dwell not on it. You doubtlessly have experiences ahead which will render you wise to the world. Decades stretch before you - and the coming of morning before us together. Rest will not come to those who spend the whole night in conversation. You should return to the sea shortly, curious one, and I to my affairs.
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- Hooded Pitohui
I'll have to ask you pardon the double post, but I wanted this to stand apart from my epilogue rather than feeling tacked on. The game remains ongoing, so I won't offer any feedback on execution or mechanics or the like. I just want to give Ninja Squid a huge shout out for hosting, and to commemorate the original Rogues in Rogueport game.
This community has a long history of collaborative storytelling, one which has constantly renewed itself and manifested in new forms as users have come and gone, certain formats have fallen in and out of fashion, and new ideas have been trialed. The starting point of all that storytelling is lost to the sands of time, and even if a singular starting point could be marked, all that it would truly reflect is this community coming into being and joining a truly ancient tradition of storytellers.
Rogues in Rogueport is only a small point somewhere in the middle of this community's storytelling, resting on a singular thread that crosses over many others while running parallel to others still. Yet, I do think it would be a disservice not to acknowledge the tremendous impact it has had in the five years since it ran. There's an indirect line running through from RiR to games like Chaos Town Mafia, which in turn runs through to the Investigations episodes. Budding off this line are recurring characters and portrayals like Renne or Agent 47, Banana Man or Morris. Where some threads have crossed over that line, we've gotten much greater exposure to wonderful characters like Nadie or Morgan Pierce or Candice. These characters have then gone on to inclusion in other events and games, allowing them to influence an even broader array of stories and characters.
Of course, the original RiR also has a much more direct throughline to a myriad of community characters and stories in the form of Shmaluigi and the section Shmaluigi, Private Investigator. I mean, the sheer number of stories and characters that have been intertwined through the tales of Shmaluigi are staggering. Look from AKGO's cast to the likes of Specture Striker, Cayde and Siy Shilen, Kay Faraday, and Phineas J. Shoe. Characters to emerge directly from it include Chief Palmer, Woodrow Oakley, and Fordley. From its loose shared world with Waluigi Time (CEO) we gather the likes of the Bin Brothers, or have the occassional comic cameo with Kroop the flaming skull or Cosmo the travel guide-writing cat.
And each connection in turn inspires more. One needs only see the way Cloudwalker, Legend 8, Clawgrip, Boo, and BlueCat collaborate to know that!
I fondly remember RiR for what it was - a silly little game where many of us jumped in without prior experience, where we were taught by a generous fellow who did, and where we maybe played a little more loosely than we should have but got some memorable narrative interactions for that choice. I also, though, marvel at how much collaborative creativity it has stirred and ushered in its wake. It is not the start of that kind of collaboration, but it might represent the turning of a chapter in a longer history.
So thank you, Ninja Squid, for hosting a wonderful pair of games! From the looseness of the original to the high production values of this sequel, both have had a distinct character, and both have had the core fun of a good mafia game.
My thanks go, too, to the players who helped make them memorable. Whether you brought a character and some interesting narrative angle, or you played only as yourself and brought classic mafia tension, without you, these wouldn't have happened.
In the coming years, may we continue to embrace collaboration as a community, each in our own ways! Whether crafting characters, writing and hosting tales, improving and evolving the mechanics of existing games and events, coming up with new ideas altogether, or extending a welcoming hand to newcomers - let's ensure this community's storytelling and playing together stays rich and fruitful!
This community has a long history of collaborative storytelling, one which has constantly renewed itself and manifested in new forms as users have come and gone, certain formats have fallen in and out of fashion, and new ideas have been trialed. The starting point of all that storytelling is lost to the sands of time, and even if a singular starting point could be marked, all that it would truly reflect is this community coming into being and joining a truly ancient tradition of storytellers.
Rogues in Rogueport is only a small point somewhere in the middle of this community's storytelling, resting on a singular thread that crosses over many others while running parallel to others still. Yet, I do think it would be a disservice not to acknowledge the tremendous impact it has had in the five years since it ran. There's an indirect line running through from RiR to games like Chaos Town Mafia, which in turn runs through to the Investigations episodes. Budding off this line are recurring characters and portrayals like Renne or Agent 47, Banana Man or Morris. Where some threads have crossed over that line, we've gotten much greater exposure to wonderful characters like Nadie or Morgan Pierce or Candice. These characters have then gone on to inclusion in other events and games, allowing them to influence an even broader array of stories and characters.
Of course, the original RiR also has a much more direct throughline to a myriad of community characters and stories in the form of Shmaluigi and the section Shmaluigi, Private Investigator. I mean, the sheer number of stories and characters that have been intertwined through the tales of Shmaluigi are staggering. Look from AKGO's cast to the likes of Specture Striker, Cayde and Siy Shilen, Kay Faraday, and Phineas J. Shoe. Characters to emerge directly from it include Chief Palmer, Woodrow Oakley, and Fordley. From its loose shared world with Waluigi Time (CEO) we gather the likes of the Bin Brothers, or have the occassional comic cameo with Kroop the flaming skull or Cosmo the travel guide-writing cat.
And each connection in turn inspires more. One needs only see the way Cloudwalker, Legend 8, Clawgrip, Boo, and BlueCat collaborate to know that!
I fondly remember RiR for what it was - a silly little game where many of us jumped in without prior experience, where we were taught by a generous fellow who did, and where we maybe played a little more loosely than we should have but got some memorable narrative interactions for that choice. I also, though, marvel at how much collaborative creativity it has stirred and ushered in its wake. It is not the start of that kind of collaboration, but it might represent the turning of a chapter in a longer history.
So thank you, Ninja Squid, for hosting a wonderful pair of games! From the looseness of the original to the high production values of this sequel, both have had a distinct character, and both have had the core fun of a good mafia game.
My thanks go, too, to the players who helped make them memorable. Whether you brought a character and some interesting narrative angle, or you played only as yourself and brought classic mafia tension, without you, these wouldn't have happened.
In the coming years, may we continue to embrace collaboration as a community, each in our own ways! Whether crafting characters, writing and hosting tales, improving and evolving the mechanics of existing games and events, coming up with new ideas altogether, or extending a welcoming hand to newcomers - let's ensure this community's storytelling and playing together stays rich and fruitful!
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ClawgripFan9001
Pirate Crustacean
- MarioWiki
- ClawgripFan9001
"Having been vanquished by the spies Sir Yux had dispatched amongst the investigating party sent out to Rogueport to deal with the situation surrounding the Dark Crystal Star and the new uprising of the X-Naut Army, Captain ClawgripFan9001 is now doomed to an afterlife-time of servitude to the crew of phantom seafarers aboard the Flying Dutchman, meandering boundlessly over the oceans that made up the Mushroom World..."
Revin
I like wheels.
- MarioWiki
- Reverse Input
And so it was, that the uprising in Rogueport was successful. The fiends left no quarter, destroying the lives of countless innocents. The only thing that anyone remembers about that place now is the vast darkness that now clouds the evil town, and the names of the detectives who failed it shall be lost to hist-
Oh, come off it! What a load of hogwash! There's many things that are unbelievable about your latest tall tale, but chief of all of them: you really expect me to believe that no one recognised you? You're one of the most famous detectives in the world!
...Oh, but that was elementary, my dear friend. I simply changed my name, going by the moniker "Herlock Shomlès". I got the idea from an interesting story I heard about another investigator's journey into a parallel world.
..............
Seriously?! You call that a pseudonym? You just swapped the letters of your name around. It would be like Luigi Mario calling himself "Muigi Lario" and expecting no one to catch on...!
And yet, not a single one of them was able to deduce my true identity. Perhaps that's why they were unable to figure out a much more complex mystery like the identity of the mafia.
Well, if you knew so much, why didn't you save them? Leaving people to die doesn't sound like something a "great detective" would do.
Ho ho! I tried my best to gently guide their hand, and I even helped them eliminate the first of the fiends, but that just served to direct the perpetrators' ire toward me. I couldn't risk compromising my true mission, so I just snuck out during the middle of the night, leaving my would-be murderers none the wiser.
Those injuries of yours are telling a different story.
Who, me? I've got no injuries.
........
........
.........
.........*cough*
Haaa... sometimes I wonder why you feel the need to always put up that cool facade, even around me. I'm a doctor, for crying out loud.
Well, at any rate, there was nothing left for me there in Rogueport. Our old 'friend' had clearly already flown the coop. The trail had gone cold, so I decided to leave it in the capable hands of my fellow investigators, lest I find myself going cold as well. Alas, it seems they couldn't manage to finish the job.
So what now? You're just going to let the other criminals go free?
Now, now, Watson. There's only so much I can do on my own. I've already submitted my report to the relevant authorities. I'm sure there's a trusted ally of justice or two that can continue the fight. And besides...
...It wouldn't be very sporting of me to act like a sore loser after getting eliminated from the game.
And so, the great detective Sherlock Holmes and his trusty assistant Watson, now reunited, continued their quest to find their arch-nemesis. After some healthy time of rest and recovery for the injured investigator, of course. At least now he'll be able to catch up on his favourite manga in peace and quiet.
Could you please stop with the narrating?
I just thought it might help inspire you for the book you'll be writing about me.
I've told you a thousand times, Holmes. I'm not going to write a book about your exploits!
...Ho ho! We'll see.
And so, the great detective Sherlock Holmes and his trusty assistant Watson, now reunited, continued their quest to find their arch-nemesis. After some healthy time of rest and recovery for the injured investigator, of course. At least now he'll be able to catch up on his favourite manga in peace and quiet.
Please look forward to the next adventure from Sherlock Holmes and John Watson, which will be appearing in the next issue of The Strand Magazine, as made in Britain.
Lee Chaolan
Oh, excellent!
Ggs all! Thanks to Ninja Squid for hosting, was fun to play a proper non-gimmick mafia again after so long.
Got a few feedback things that I'll try to speed through because I don't want the tone of this post to come across as negative:
- Role cards (while they look great!) needed a bit more information. There was a few small things that weren't specified (like Revin's jailing preventing other roles, not just kills edit: It think I got mixed up here, Revin roleblocked me but they way NS described the action "failing" made it sound like I wasn't roleblocked, seems that was more of a communication error), and ideally all the information should be lined out at the beginning, especially since other players will need that information as well once the player dies.
- Already mentioned in mafia chat, but mafia having two inno-appearing roles and no role cop was a little unbalanced.
- If daylight savings happens in your timezone it would be best to announce it beforehand as the phase seemingly moved forward an hour for me without reason, this is an easy thing to miss so I don't plan the host for not announcing anything, but good for future hosts to be aware of.
- The daytime curse gimmicks were a fun idea but the execution felt a little weird, not really a fan of events that lead to the elimination coming down to RNG but it did at least lead to some interesting plays.
Finally wanted to shout out the new players here, was fun seeing people like Boo and Sparks correctly cast suspicion towards some of us, Cloudwalker and Clawgrip gradually get better ideas on what makes people suspicious or not (room for improvement obviously! But promising nevertheless) and YoshitheSSM for being a true force to be reckoned with in the late game.
While there were a few small hiccups along the way it was overall a be try fun game and I hope to see all of you in another game again in the future!
Got a few feedback things that I'll try to speed through because I don't want the tone of this post to come across as negative:
- Role cards (while they look great!) needed a bit more information. There was a few small things that weren't specified (
- Already mentioned in mafia chat, but mafia having two inno-appearing roles and no role cop was a little unbalanced.
- If daylight savings happens in your timezone it would be best to announce it beforehand as the phase seemingly moved forward an hour for me without reason, this is an easy thing to miss so I don't plan the host for not announcing anything, but good for future hosts to be aware of.
- The daytime curse gimmicks were a fun idea but the execution felt a little weird, not really a fan of events that lead to the elimination coming down to RNG but it did at least lead to some interesting plays.
Finally wanted to shout out the new players here, was fun seeing people like Boo and Sparks correctly cast suspicion towards some of us, Cloudwalker and Clawgrip gradually get better ideas on what makes people suspicious or not (room for improvement obviously! But promising nevertheless) and YoshitheSSM for being a true force to be reckoned with in the late game.
While there were a few small hiccups along the way it was overall a be try fun game and I hope to see all of you in another game again in the future!
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Shmaluigi
Private Investigator
Core 'Shroom Staff
Awards Committee
Poll Committee
Retired Wiki Staff
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Well there goes any credibility I have in these games for a while lol
GGs everyone, very well-played game, that was not an easy win by any means. Special shoutout to YtSSM who was especially on fire there, really impressed with how you did. Sorry for tricking you guys! But it did feel good to finally win a game as mafia instead of getting voted out within the first couple of days because my brilliant strategy of "VOTE OUT ALL THE TOWNIES" in a post-Morris economy made me look sus. Who could've guessed?
Anyway this was a lot of fun and the visual design was on point, great celebration of five years since the original game. Honestly I was surprised by how much I enjoyed the game - nothing to do with my expectations of NS' work of course, just that we got to a point where Mafia felt like it had been kind of played out so I was a little unsure how things would go - but dang if this wasn't some of the most fun I've had playing one of these. So big thanks to NS for putting the time and energy into hosting this, and looking forward to playing with you fine folks again sometime!
...But uh, if we do play more Mafia maybe we should space them out a little more than every 1-2 months. Past experience and all that.
(Also if you've been following along with my escapades in the longest mafia game ever, yes Chester has a time-displaced clone now)
GGs everyone, very well-played game, that was not an easy win by any means. Special shoutout to YtSSM who was especially on fire there, really impressed with how you did. Sorry for tricking you guys! But it did feel good to finally win a game as mafia instead of getting voted out within the first couple of days because my brilliant strategy of "VOTE OUT ALL THE TOWNIES" in a post-Morris economy made me look sus. Who could've guessed?
Anyway this was a lot of fun and the visual design was on point, great celebration of five years since the original game. Honestly I was surprised by how much I enjoyed the game - nothing to do with my expectations of NS' work of course, just that we got to a point where Mafia felt like it had been kind of played out so I was a little unsure how things would go - but dang if this wasn't some of the most fun I've had playing one of these. So big thanks to NS for putting the time and energy into hosting this, and looking forward to playing with you fine folks again sometime!
...But uh, if we do play more Mafia maybe we should space them out a little more than every 1-2 months. Past experience and all that.
(Also if you've been following along with my escapades in the longest mafia game ever, yes Chester has a time-displaced clone now)
Glitz Yoshi
The Great Gonzales
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- MarioWiki
- Yoshi the SSM
*Glitz Yoshi laid flat on the ground. And when he saw the coast was clear, he got up. However, something strange happened. He then all of sudden transformed.*
Doopliss: "So you thought that Glitz Yoshi returned. Well I got a surprise for you. It was me the whole time. And now that my form has been revealed, it's time for me to do something fun."
Feedback will be provided some time after I wake up tomorrow.
Doopliss: "So you thought that Glitz Yoshi returned. Well I got a surprise for you. It was me the whole time. And now that my form has been revealed, it's time for me to do something fun."Feedback will be provided some time after I wake up tomorrow.
Revin
I like wheels.
- MarioWiki
- Reverse Input
I was also surprised with how much fun I had with this game, mostly because I look back at the mafia games from a few years ago and only think about how serious and mad all the thinking and metagaming made me, so it was nice to be able to play a game that was fun and enjoyable. I will also leave a few quick feedback points:
-I would probably echo a lot of nine's thoughts, particularly around the curses.
-I'm not too sure how to feel about the location roles. Having additional powers that are publicly known is interesting, but as we saw, both with Rose's statements and also in a lot of the mafia's chats, it opens up a huge can of worms for metagaming. Like, I personally kinda wrote it off at the beginning, but it was absolutely correct that 1 out of 4 town house residents was mafia. If it's a one-off feature then I guess it isn't a huge deal, but yeah, not sure how I feel about it.
-My least favourite part of the game was probably the reverse vote phase, because it was kind of a curveball that messed with the whole thought process of the game, and then when we did manage to adapt and at least get to an interesting spot, the entire thing got undermined by BigBoom being killed off specifically for inactivity instead of the wheel picking it, which made me feel a little cheated and like the past two phases were a huge waste (particularly since I was 75% sure I had managed to buy us extra time by jailing Coco and making it so there was no nightkill, which did end up turning out to be true). Like, if I'm gonna be living through a difficult, game-changing gimmick, it would be nice for the gimmick to actually happen, even if the result would have been functionally the same and we lynched BigBoom the next day.
--In general, I understand the need to remove inactive players for game health, but I would have preferred a replacement rather than an outright removal, because modkills kind of mess with the number balancing of the game (e.g. if you plan a 16 player game, then modkill 2 townies for inactivity, that gets you to mylo/lylo a whole day sooner. If you replace them, at least it preserves the game structure even if those replacements end up getting lynched). I know from experience that replacing players and knowing when to remove inactives is really tough to make a call on, particularly for people that are posting once every 3 phases so barely still technically active, but it's unfortunately an inevitability that it'll need to happen, so it would be good to plan and communicate ahead of time what a "removal" looks like so people don't feel blindsided when it happens in a different way than expected.
Other than that stuff, it was a good game and I had fun, so that's ultimately the most important thing. Despite how things played out with gimmicks and locations and roles, I do think the mafia win was well deserved, with a lot of thought toward well-timed, strategic nightkills, and some good posts during the day, so props for pulling off the win. And, of course, big thanks to Ninja Squid for hosting, thank you for all the effort you put into planning and running another excellent game for us!
-I would probably echo a lot of nine's thoughts, particularly around the curses.
-I'm not too sure how to feel about the location roles. Having additional powers that are publicly known is interesting, but as we saw, both with Rose's statements and also in a lot of the mafia's chats, it opens up a huge can of worms for metagaming. Like, I personally kinda wrote it off at the beginning, but it was absolutely correct that 1 out of 4 town house residents was mafia. If it's a one-off feature then I guess it isn't a huge deal, but yeah, not sure how I feel about it.
-My least favourite part of the game was probably the reverse vote phase, because it was kind of a curveball that messed with the whole thought process of the game, and then when we did manage to adapt and at least get to an interesting spot, the entire thing got undermined by BigBoom being killed off specifically for inactivity instead of the wheel picking it, which made me feel a little cheated and like the past two phases were a huge waste (particularly since I was 75% sure I had managed to buy us extra time by jailing Coco and making it so there was no nightkill, which did end up turning out to be true). Like, if I'm gonna be living through a difficult, game-changing gimmick, it would be nice for the gimmick to actually happen, even if the result would have been functionally the same and we lynched BigBoom the next day.
--In general, I understand the need to remove inactive players for game health, but I would have preferred a replacement rather than an outright removal, because modkills kind of mess with the number balancing of the game (e.g. if you plan a 16 player game, then modkill 2 townies for inactivity, that gets you to mylo/lylo a whole day sooner. If you replace them, at least it preserves the game structure even if those replacements end up getting lynched). I know from experience that replacing players and knowing when to remove inactives is really tough to make a call on, particularly for people that are posting once every 3 phases so barely still technically active, but it's unfortunately an inevitability that it'll need to happen, so it would be good to plan and communicate ahead of time what a "removal" looks like so people don't feel blindsided when it happens in a different way than expected.
Other than that stuff, it was a good game and I had fun, so that's ultimately the most important thing. Despite how things played out with gimmicks and locations and roles, I do think the mafia win was well deserved, with a lot of thought toward well-timed, strategic nightkills, and some good posts during the day, so props for pulling off the win. And, of course, big thanks to Ninja Squid for hosting, thank you for all the effort you put into planning and running another excellent game for us!
- Pronouns
- He/Him |Boo1268
(As Shmalu Sniffer layed on the ground of the now over taken town of rougeport, now consumed by darkness, inspite of the damage dealt to him by the mafia Shmalu Sniffer was still standing, he was tougher than he looked, however it wouldnt be long before he too was to be consumed by the darkness...)
Shmalu Sniffer:
*COUGH* *COUGH* I-Im sorry see...I f-failed you all....I guess I-I never really was a good sniffstigator now was I?
(However moments before the nose was to be fully dismanteled by the Yux nauts Atlas the owl QUICKLY swooped in a snached up what remained of Shmalu Sniffer clawing and pecking at the remaining Yux Nauts as he flew away....)
Atlas:
Who...
(Arriving through the window of a small toy shop, Atlas makes his way inside, carefully carrying Shmalu Sniffer as he does and places him on a small work table, suddenly he presses a button on a strange robot placed atop a pillar.)
Mr Helpful:
HELLLO! Welcome to Edwin Murrays Playtime store! weve got toys, games, costumes & robots out the WAZZO! Need special repairs? WE GOT EM! To place a toy order just press 1, to learn more about our humble store just press 2, to request urgent repairs just press 3-
(Quickly Atlas presses the third button, even going out of his way to press it multiple times, eventually at some point he hears a voice from upstars.)
???: Alright, Alright, I'll be down in a moment!
Emerging down the stair of the upper part of the store was a young man with glasses, he seemd somewhat tired and looked as if he was prepared to go out for the night to some fancy escapade.
Edwin Murray:
Im sorry sir but were about to close, so if this could just wait till tommorow-
(However looking around Edwin saw nobody, not a person, Koopa, or any humanoid being in sight, it was almost as if someone just, flew away, looking at the work bench, Edwin saw a strange nose like toy that was badly beaten up, all that lay next to it was a purple feather.)
Edwin Murray:
Umm, Hello? Sir or Madam? You left your toy here!......huh strange....oh well I got the time, lets see if we cant fix you up little buddy.
Failure is what makes great people and it seems as if, it is one failure that has, ironically, lead to the creation of yet another private investigator, all ariseing from the seedy town of rough port, will Shmalu Sniffer uncover his idenity? Will Rouge Port be saved? only time as all things will tell, but at most one thing is certain....Shmalu Sniffer will return.
Shmalu Sniffer:
*COUGH* *COUGH* I-Im sorry see...I f-failed you all....I guess I-I never really was a good sniffstigator now was I?
(However moments before the nose was to be fully dismanteled by the Yux nauts Atlas the owl QUICKLY swooped in a snached up what remained of Shmalu Sniffer clawing and pecking at the remaining Yux Nauts as he flew away....)
Sometime later
Atlas:
Who...
(Arriving through the window of a small toy shop, Atlas makes his way inside, carefully carrying Shmalu Sniffer as he does and places him on a small work table, suddenly he presses a button on a strange robot placed atop a pillar.)
Mr Helpful:
HELLLO! Welcome to Edwin Murrays Playtime store! weve got toys, games, costumes & robots out the WAZZO! Need special repairs? WE GOT EM! To place a toy order just press 1, to learn more about our humble store just press 2, to request urgent repairs just press 3-
(Quickly Atlas presses the third button, even going out of his way to press it multiple times, eventually at some point he hears a voice from upstars.)
???: Alright, Alright, I'll be down in a moment!
Emerging down the stair of the upper part of the store was a young man with glasses, he seemd somewhat tired and looked as if he was prepared to go out for the night to some fancy escapade.
Edwin Murray:
Im sorry sir but were about to close, so if this could just wait till tommorow-
(However looking around Edwin saw nobody, not a person, Koopa, or any humanoid being in sight, it was almost as if someone just, flew away, looking at the work bench, Edwin saw a strange nose like toy that was badly beaten up, all that lay next to it was a purple feather.)
Edwin Murray:
Umm, Hello? Sir or Madam? You left your toy here!......huh strange....oh well I got the time, lets see if we cant fix you up little buddy.
Failure is what makes great people and it seems as if, it is one failure that has, ironically, lead to the creation of yet another private investigator, all ariseing from the seedy town of rough port, will Shmalu Sniffer uncover his idenity? Will Rouge Port be saved? only time as all things will tell, but at most one thing is certain....Shmalu Sniffer will return.
- Pronouns
- They
- MarioWiki
- Roserade
Echoing many sentiments offered before: this was an overall engaging game that reminded me of why I find mafia fun, and it provided enough mixups on the standard format to be, if nothing else, a good touchstone for future mafia iterations. The new ideas presented here could use some tweaking, but almost every new idea will. Locations being tied to powers is neat, but I'm not sure about the system with Wandering Players, and I'm not sure about having location movement being tied to one other location-based power, especially when I had the power to blow that place up whenever. Curses were also fun shake-ups, though the one I found the most interesting was pretty quickly undercut by the Silencer, so that's food for thought. If these return, I certainly think ones that effect the voting or the daytime proceedings are the best path; the "three statements where one is true" bunch are kind of odd, because it's hard to know how a host would remain unbiased in what they share and which side that info more directly benefits.
Good games to our Traitors, who really did pull off some impressive innocent fronting. WT in particular had a pretty stellar performance as fake-inno for this entire game. It would've taken our numbers dwindling to six for me to really start questioning his allegiance. True inno MVP here was YtSSM - this was absolutely your best performance in a mafia game and it's exhilarating to see how far you've come. You even had your senses honed right with Nine at the end there. Even if WT pulled the wool over your eyes a bit, I hope you're still proud of yourself. Super stellar work. Glad to have been included in the Neighborhood briefly
Overall notes are similar to what was mentioned above, I think the Traitor role pool was a little too skewed against more information-based Investigator roles. Two innocent-facing Traitors were a super hard counter to just having an alignment cop on our end, but I'm also not sure if the role blocker needed to be a ninja? A bit up in the air on that since both movement-based roles went underutilized for the runtime, and it's hard to know how role balance ultimately works out when roles aren't used to their fullest. Beyond that though, I think the overall pool was good. Neighborizer is an excellent role that should be automatically acclimated into every Mafia game moving forward, imo. It's a perfect bridging point that allows inno players to still coordinate while also having inherent risk to discussion. I'm happy this idea of Nexus of Chaos saw revitalization here.
In general, I think gameplay was solid. There were a lot of new faces this time around, so I don't particularly blame any missteps along the way. That said, I do want to give one last bit of advice to my fellow Investigators who were fresh on the scene. There were plenty of moments where people were encouraging you to remain silent, because information just being in the open is dangerous. This is true! Not everything should be revealed, and if you are role claiming, you have to be mindful of how it comes across, as seen with the suspicion tossed onto Coco and Flotzo. However, there are times when sharing information is important. To highlight just two examples:
-If Cloud had role claimed as the Doctor and confirmed that she wasn't responsible for the no-kill night, there was a solid chance Flotzo's claim would've been more readily believed
-This same thing is true to a much greater extent for Clawgrip, who did actually shoot at Flotzo that night
This information is very valuable in innocent hands, but it must be done at the right time. When you're about to share private info publicly, ask yourself this: does sharing this information put my team at an overall advantage? You have to think about the timing. If numbers are dwindling, the chances of the answer being "yes" rise. Typically, you'll want to share info during the day, since that's when people are better-suited to react to it. There will always be a risk to sharing info, but if that info is the potential contingency for a win or loss, don't be afraid to share it.
Mafia is a vibes game, so it's always a process of learning the vibes. I'm glad everyone who actively participated signed up, though. It makes me happy to see new people interested in old classics and reimagined forum staples!
Long winding spiel aside, great work overall, loved the aesthetics on display, uhhhhh don't trust wt again thx
Good games to our Traitors, who really did pull off some impressive innocent fronting. WT in particular had a pretty stellar performance as fake-inno for this entire game. It would've taken our numbers dwindling to six for me to really start questioning his allegiance. True inno MVP here was YtSSM - this was absolutely your best performance in a mafia game and it's exhilarating to see how far you've come. You even had your senses honed right with Nine at the end there. Even if WT pulled the wool over your eyes a bit, I hope you're still proud of yourself. Super stellar work. Glad to have been included in the Neighborhood briefly
Overall notes are similar to what was mentioned above, I think the Traitor role pool was a little too skewed against more information-based Investigator roles. Two innocent-facing Traitors were a super hard counter to just having an alignment cop on our end, but I'm also not sure if the role blocker needed to be a ninja? A bit up in the air on that since both movement-based roles went underutilized for the runtime, and it's hard to know how role balance ultimately works out when roles aren't used to their fullest. Beyond that though, I think the overall pool was good. Neighborizer is an excellent role that should be automatically acclimated into every Mafia game moving forward, imo. It's a perfect bridging point that allows inno players to still coordinate while also having inherent risk to discussion. I'm happy this idea of Nexus of Chaos saw revitalization here.
In general, I think gameplay was solid. There were a lot of new faces this time around, so I don't particularly blame any missteps along the way. That said, I do want to give one last bit of advice to my fellow Investigators who were fresh on the scene. There were plenty of moments where people were encouraging you to remain silent, because information just being in the open is dangerous. This is true! Not everything should be revealed, and if you are role claiming, you have to be mindful of how it comes across, as seen with the suspicion tossed onto Coco and Flotzo. However, there are times when sharing information is important. To highlight just two examples:
-If Cloud had role claimed as the Doctor and confirmed that she wasn't responsible for the no-kill night, there was a solid chance Flotzo's claim would've been more readily believed
-This same thing is true to a much greater extent for Clawgrip, who did actually shoot at Flotzo that night
This information is very valuable in innocent hands, but it must be done at the right time. When you're about to share private info publicly, ask yourself this: does sharing this information put my team at an overall advantage? You have to think about the timing. If numbers are dwindling, the chances of the answer being "yes" rise. Typically, you'll want to share info during the day, since that's when people are better-suited to react to it. There will always be a risk to sharing info, but if that info is the potential contingency for a win or loss, don't be afraid to share it.
Mafia is a vibes game, so it's always a process of learning the vibes. I'm glad everyone who actively participated signed up, though. It makes me happy to see new people interested in old classics and reimagined forum staples!
Long winding spiel aside, great work overall, loved the aesthetics on display, uhhhhh don't trust wt again thx
ClawgripFan9001
Pirate Crustacean
- MarioWiki
- ClawgripFan9001
Yeah, I realized that as soon as I was out of the game, I had fucked things up for my team by not vouching for Flotzo's innocence when I still had the chance. But that was a matter of me believing that since I knew that Flotzo was Bulletproof and revealing this out in the open could have made him a potential target for the Mafia, so I chose to keep that info for myself in order to protect Flotzo from being targeted, but that move came back to bite me in the ass later on, since as soon as I bit the bullet, Flotzo ended up being targeted anyway. As such, I largely consider the Innocents losing this game to be my fault for not vouching Flotzo's innocence as a result of flawed intuition. That, and making the mistake of putting too much trust in WT, whom I gotta give credit where credit's due for playing one of the most poker-faced Mafia roles I've seen in a game in ages.
Other than that, I pretty much share the sentiments of everyone else who gave constructive feedback on the course of this Mafia game, and I said it once, and I'll say it again: I had an absolute blast playing this game!
- Pronouns
- He/him
- MarioWiki
- Hooded Pitohui
I wouldn't put any singular blame on you. This game was pretty down-to-the-wire and there are a bunch of places where a single shift could have altered the outcome. A different approach to the cop claim, had BigBoom not been eliminated for inactivity instead of me getting RNG booted, the mafia picking a protected target in the last phase, and more could have changed the outcome.
You've learned a bit more about when to speak and when to not, and that's good to carry forward, but don't shoulder the blame on yourself for what was a very close game. You did well. You had us very scared for a good half of the game.
Glitz Yoshi
The Great Gonzales
- Pronouns
- he/him
- MarioWiki
- Yoshi the SSM
It's time for the feedback that I promised. First off, the events. I was fortunate to have gotten one of these and they seem like they make you think of some of the strategy you want to do in the next phase. But it seemed to be on purpose because it appeared after I voted for Flotzo. And due to how I read it, I thought the first option would have caused Flotzo to be voted out in the next day phase. Anyways. As you know, I chose the truth one. But it was also nice to see the double vote one that I saw be used later on. I think more of these in role-madness games only would be nice to see.
Next up, roles. No need to state more than what was already said other that this. In the first Rougeport game, there were two inno cops and no godfathers. This seems to have overcorrected and had one inno cop and two people basically godfather. But if you made the Strengthened Godfather just the Strenghtener, I think it might have been balanced. Even if in the end, it wouldn't have made much of a difference. But it was also fun using the Neighborizer role after the other was lynched. Even if I did get spooked by not only something that wasn't the case in the end but seeing evidence that wasn't true either. But I thought that I needed to have both Rose and Waluigi Time in the Neighborhood due to Boo's role and to give each a fair chance. Had I followed Rose's advice and brought Clawgrip to the Neighborhood instead of Waluigi Time, things would have been different. Maybe then he could tell me and Boo about the shoot on the bulletproof. Anyways. As for my main power, it gave me the option of choosing whichever power I wanted at the cost of waiting for that particular power to be removed. But it was nice using both of these powers myself and not just see others using it.
And now to address this...
Hindsight indeed. For those who were wondering, there was a wheel that was spun for fun and it chose Pito. So, in the end, the host chose to lynch an innocent due to inactivity over a mafia that was contributing. This decision was to stop harm from being done to the innocents. However, due to Coco also being inactive, this decision ended up doing more harm than good as we were unable to lynch mafia two-day phases in a row but also forced to lynch innocents instead. Something that greatly helped the mafia side. As a matter of fact, this was the main reason why I also voted to eliminate Coco as I saw that trying to get a Pito lynch with double votes would be very hard to accomplish. And seeing as I knew that this happened to BigBoom, there was no way of being able to stop Coco from being the one chosen. Although, when I decided to make the decision, Waluigi Time already had voted for Coco. But if you are running a game and you have inactive people, be careful how you do them and make sure to do it fairly and to consider other inactive people.
Now for the game itself overall. This was such a great game. And the moment I realized that it was Waluigi Time and Nine that were mafia, it was already too late. But I wanted to give the Neighborizer info out just in case the doctor was lucky and got the 1/3 chance. But mafia won because they had the 2/3 chance. But it was nice playing one of these again. Anyways GGs, mafia.
Also, I have redeemed my past mistake and was able to correctly do a Pito vs. me battle that I incorrectly did in Sheep Mafia. Also, thanks for the encouragement, guys.
Shmaluigi
Private Investigator
Core 'Shroom Staff
Awards Committee
Poll Committee
Retired Wiki Staff
- Pronouns
- He/him
@Shmalu Sniffer asked this question in the mafia chat. I was going to respond there but since we have multiple new players, and this could be generally useful info, I figured I would post it publicly.
The best way to look at it is that Mafia is not a roleplay, it is first and foremost a strategy game. A lot of players enjoy RPing as specific characters to add some extra pizzazz, but those characters are ultimately just set dressing and do not affect gameplay in any way and should not be expected to. Trying to deflect suspicion from yourself or cast it onto someone else for purely character-based reasons is a rookie mistake that will at best be called out as such, and at worst make you look more suspicious. All legitimate suspicion is going to come from analyzing player actions, knowledge gained from roles, and to some extent metagaming (for example, Rose's theory that someone in the Town Houses was mafia going purely off numbers - this had nothing to do with what any of the players were doing or any info gained from roles, but it was right on the money).
For the record, "from a character perspective" is something that should never be a consideration in Mafia. Since roles and alignments are predetermined by the host, there's no expectation that a player's character matches their alignment. That makes sense because it would obviously be a very different game if it boiled down to which characters could be evil. You can choose to play a character who's pacifist or anything like that, but if the host assigns you to the mafia team then that's the way you have to play the game. This differs from KG where roles are still largely predetermined by the host, but the night action system allows you to be in full control of what your character does.
The best way to look at it is that Mafia is not a roleplay, it is first and foremost a strategy game. A lot of players enjoy RPing as specific characters to add some extra pizzazz, but those characters are ultimately just set dressing and do not affect gameplay in any way and should not be expected to. Trying to deflect suspicion from yourself or cast it onto someone else for purely character-based reasons is a rookie mistake that will at best be called out as such, and at worst make you look more suspicious. All legitimate suspicion is going to come from analyzing player actions, knowledge gained from roles, and to some extent metagaming (for example, Rose's theory that someone in the Town Houses was mafia going purely off numbers - this had nothing to do with what any of the players were doing or any info gained from roles, but it was right on the money).
- Pronouns
- He/him
- MarioWiki
- Ninja Squid
- Thread starter
- #48
Post-game thoughts from the host!
GENERAL THOUGHTS
This game was very fun to host, but man, it felt like a total marathon, and I feel completely exhausted from it. Still, it leaves me with a good feeling inside. It was great to see all the different interactions and jokes that happened throughout the game, and that ended up being one of my favorite aspects of RiR2! So, a big shoutout to everyone who actively engaged and committed to it. From Agent F, Rock Paper Wizard, Chester, Sherlock Shomlès, Mr N, and Tasse, to name a few. I would absolutely love to see an opportunity or collab done including these characters again in the future. They really made this game memorable.
This was a long game in the makings. As you may be aware, I originally intended to host Rogues in Rogueport 2 way back in 2023, but unfortunately had to cancel it. That said, this version was built completely from the ground up in some ways because, at some point (I don't remember exactly when I did) I realized that I had lost all the files I had created at the time.
As you may notice, there are still some gameplay features that remained the same between the two versions, and that mostly comes from sheer memory of what I initially wanted to do with those gameplay elements. That said, there are still things that might have played out differently.
Because of that (due to the game being cancelled), I wanted to keep those original ideas in mind while also thinking about gameplay mechanics I might want to use later on if I hosted some kind of mafia-style game with more strategy involved. So, I came to a point where I wanted to completely shelve any attempt at doing RiR2 in favour of something different. In the end though, when we reached the fifth anniversary of the original Rogues in Rogueport game, surprise surprise, I ended up with the desire to host Rogues in Rogueport 2 lol.
GAMEPLAY
Among the gameplay elements that I kept from the original version of Rogues in Rogueport 2 were the Location Roles and the Events gimmicks. My vision during the development of this version was primarily to add different strategic perspectives, while also spicing things up a little bit.
The choice to remove the currency system (which was originally there to add an incentive for engagement, since coins would have been earned simply by playing the game) and the items (if I recall correctly, these would have functioned as different kinds of modifiers, such as one-shot powers; I actually remember that one of the powers planned would have allowed player to communicate exclusively with another player for one night) was made to simplify the game as much as possible. I felt that the Location Roles and Events were the more important mechanics I wanted to experiment with, and that they were more than sufficient in terms of gimmicks.
To delve deeper into the subject of strategic perspectives, this is where the Location Roles came into play. I was quite interested in the ideas of players having roles that were publicly known to everyone in the game. I wanted to see how that would turn out, and what kinds of strategies it might create from the player's perspectives.
Both the mafia and the town could make use of these roles, which could lead to interesting situations regarding how and why they would choose to use their powers. Mafia and town players would not necessarily use their abilities for the same reasons, which could shape the strategy behind each decision. I also found interesting that other players knew that this specific player can do this. Because of that, they had to approach the game while keeping that information in mind. For example, in the context of this game, the mafia knowing that a particular town player had a certain ability could make targeting or avoiding that player feel riskier, or even seen them as an advantages for them if they were able to persuade such specific player.
Personally, I think it's an idea that could be developed further, but it's also incredibly important to carefully consider the balance if you want to use something like this. You don't want either the town or the mafia to gain too large of an advantage over the other. With that said, now that I've seen how it ended up being used during Rogues in Rogueport 2, I have somewhat mixed feelings about it. The Oracle power allowing the mafia to quickly pinpoint where the Alignment Cop could be, or the Town Houses meta, are some prime examples that come to mind. Perhaps with a different set of roles or a different executions of that idea, it could played out differently, but that remains to be seen.
Then, regarding the curse gimmicks, they came from a desire to make each Day/Night cycle feel a bit different every time. The goal was to make players think and strategize differently each phase, rather than going into every cycle with the same thoughts, ideas, or plans in advance while knowing the exact same routine would happen each Day or Night. In a way, it was meant to push players to engage differently or reconsider their next move, since they wouldn't know exactly what was going to happen next. In retrospect, that might have been a bit of a mean gimmick lol, but the intention was to encourage players to approach each round with a fresh perspective, which could open the door to different scenarios. It can definitely lead to interesting angles, bit it's also somewhat risky. I'd rather avoid nightmare scenarios where it turns into something too frustrating or overly wacky. Maybe it's better to keep something like this at a more surface level so it can remain unexpected while still being fun enough to engage with.
My personal favorite was the Reverse Elimination Day, because it really forces you to think differently about how to approach the Day phase elimination as a whole. That said, I ended up a bit mad at myself with how it played out, because of the way I used it to remove an inactive player (which was totally unfair). In hindsight, I should have handled that differently. It's probably one of my biggest pet peeves about this game, and it leads into my next thought.
Please, if you intend on signing up for a game, especially Mafia, you really need to think about the level of commitment it requires and whether you actually have the time to stay engaged with it. Nobody should be expected to sit there 24/7 for the entire duration of that game. It's perfectly fine to step away at times, especially since Mafia games can run for quite a while. However, you also need to be honest and open about the possibility that might hit periods where you're unable to contribute as much. On the other hand, if you sign up and don't engage at all throughout the entire duration of the game, then please don't sign up in the first place. It can be incredibly frustrating from a game balance perspective, because certain roles may never get used, which can be detrimental to whichever side you're on (especially if such roles are extremely valuable for town or mafia). It can also make things much more tedious for the host to manage.
Unfortunately, I didn't plan for this situation well enough myself, and that's something I'd strongly encourage anyone planning to host a Mafia game in the future to think about in advance. Specifically, what you plan will be if a player becomes completely inactive. Revin brought up a very good point regarding the situation that happened with BigBoom, and that's definitely valuable to keep in mind going forward.
This game was very fun to host, but man, it felt like a total marathon, and I feel completely exhausted from it. Still, it leaves me with a good feeling inside. It was great to see all the different interactions and jokes that happened throughout the game, and that ended up being one of my favorite aspects of RiR2! So, a big shoutout to everyone who actively engaged and committed to it. From Agent F, Rock Paper Wizard, Chester, Sherlock Shomlès, Mr N, and Tasse, to name a few. I would absolutely love to see an opportunity or collab done including these characters again in the future. They really made this game memorable.
This was a long game in the makings. As you may be aware, I originally intended to host Rogues in Rogueport 2 way back in 2023, but unfortunately had to cancel it. That said, this version was built completely from the ground up in some ways because, at some point (I don't remember exactly when I did) I realized that I had lost all the files I had created at the time.
As you may notice, there are still some gameplay features that remained the same between the two versions, and that mostly comes from sheer memory of what I initially wanted to do with those gameplay elements. That said, there are still things that might have played out differently.
Because of that (due to the game being cancelled), I wanted to keep those original ideas in mind while also thinking about gameplay mechanics I might want to use later on if I hosted some kind of mafia-style game with more strategy involved. So, I came to a point where I wanted to completely shelve any attempt at doing RiR2 in favour of something different. In the end though, when we reached the fifth anniversary of the original Rogues in Rogueport game, surprise surprise, I ended up with the desire to host Rogues in Rogueport 2 lol.
GAMEPLAY
Among the gameplay elements that I kept from the original version of Rogues in Rogueport 2 were the Location Roles and the Events gimmicks. My vision during the development of this version was primarily to add different strategic perspectives, while also spicing things up a little bit.
The choice to remove the currency system (which was originally there to add an incentive for engagement, since coins would have been earned simply by playing the game) and the items (if I recall correctly, these would have functioned as different kinds of modifiers, such as one-shot powers; I actually remember that one of the powers planned would have allowed player to communicate exclusively with another player for one night) was made to simplify the game as much as possible. I felt that the Location Roles and Events were the more important mechanics I wanted to experiment with, and that they were more than sufficient in terms of gimmicks.
To delve deeper into the subject of strategic perspectives, this is where the Location Roles came into play. I was quite interested in the ideas of players having roles that were publicly known to everyone in the game. I wanted to see how that would turn out, and what kinds of strategies it might create from the player's perspectives.
Both the mafia and the town could make use of these roles, which could lead to interesting situations regarding how and why they would choose to use their powers. Mafia and town players would not necessarily use their abilities for the same reasons, which could shape the strategy behind each decision. I also found interesting that other players knew that this specific player can do this. Because of that, they had to approach the game while keeping that information in mind. For example, in the context of this game, the mafia knowing that a particular town player had a certain ability could make targeting or avoiding that player feel riskier, or even seen them as an advantages for them if they were able to persuade such specific player.
Personally, I think it's an idea that could be developed further, but it's also incredibly important to carefully consider the balance if you want to use something like this. You don't want either the town or the mafia to gain too large of an advantage over the other. With that said, now that I've seen how it ended up being used during Rogues in Rogueport 2, I have somewhat mixed feelings about it. The Oracle power allowing the mafia to quickly pinpoint where the Alignment Cop could be, or the Town Houses meta, are some prime examples that come to mind. Perhaps with a different set of roles or a different executions of that idea, it could played out differently, but that remains to be seen.
Then, regarding the curse gimmicks, they came from a desire to make each Day/Night cycle feel a bit different every time. The goal was to make players think and strategize differently each phase, rather than going into every cycle with the same thoughts, ideas, or plans in advance while knowing the exact same routine would happen each Day or Night. In a way, it was meant to push players to engage differently or reconsider their next move, since they wouldn't know exactly what was going to happen next. In retrospect, that might have been a bit of a mean gimmick lol, but the intention was to encourage players to approach each round with a fresh perspective, which could open the door to different scenarios. It can definitely lead to interesting angles, bit it's also somewhat risky. I'd rather avoid nightmare scenarios where it turns into something too frustrating or overly wacky. Maybe it's better to keep something like this at a more surface level so it can remain unexpected while still being fun enough to engage with.
My personal favorite was the Reverse Elimination Day, because it really forces you to think differently about how to approach the Day phase elimination as a whole. That said, I ended up a bit mad at myself with how it played out, because of the way I used it to remove an inactive player (which was totally unfair). In hindsight, I should have handled that differently. It's probably one of my biggest pet peeves about this game, and it leads into my next thought.
Please, if you intend on signing up for a game, especially Mafia, you really need to think about the level of commitment it requires and whether you actually have the time to stay engaged with it. Nobody should be expected to sit there 24/7 for the entire duration of that game. It's perfectly fine to step away at times, especially since Mafia games can run for quite a while. However, you also need to be honest and open about the possibility that might hit periods where you're unable to contribute as much. On the other hand, if you sign up and don't engage at all throughout the entire duration of the game, then please don't sign up in the first place. It can be incredibly frustrating from a game balance perspective, because certain roles may never get used, which can be detrimental to whichever side you're on (especially if such roles are extremely valuable for town or mafia). It can also make things much more tedious for the host to manage.
Unfortunately, I didn't plan for this situation well enough myself, and that's something I'd strongly encourage anyone planning to host a Mafia game in the future to think about in advance. Specifically, what you plan will be if a player becomes completely inactive. Revin brought up a very good point regarding the situation that happened with BigBoom, and that's definitely valuable to keep in mind going forward.
STORY
For the original version of Rogues in Rogueport 2, the intention was to have Sticky Warrior and Ms. Mowz as antagonists possessed by the Crystal Stars. Their soul would have been imprisoned within the Crystal Stars leaving them being corrupted by a similar process to what I did with Grodus who became Sir Yux. I think I also wanted to give little hints that other characters from the original RiR might have been in imprisoned in the other Crystal Stars. I was also considering giving some more lore about Sticky Warrior and from where he came from (such as his real name). Since the game ended up being cancelled, several of those ideas later became used in the Triple Trouble story arc of Shmaluigi, Private Investigator.
Overall, the characters of Sir Yux and Johnson stayed relatively the same compared to the original concept. At one point, I even considered using a map system where Sticky and Ms. Mowz would perform certain actions during the night on behalf of the mafia. In the end, I scrapped that system entirely during the development of the original RiR2.
While working on the newer version of Rogues in Rogueport 2, I decided to phase out Sticky and Ms. Mowz and instead focus on a simpler story centred around the Dark Crystal Star. The decision to remove them from the main narrative and keep them only as easter eggs referencing the original game was made so that Rogues in Rogueport 2 could have its own identity, rather than feeling just like a direct follow-up to the first Rogues in Rogueport.
I also think I initially intended to follow a similar story structure to the first game with RiR2. However, I ultimately chose to keep things more simplistic here in order to give players more freedom to build their own narrative through their role-play. This way, they could develop their own stories and interactions instead of relying on a narrative already been built for them in advance, like the first game.
POWER ROLES
Okay, the roles used during this game went through a long process. At first, I had fun creating a list of roles that I thought were interesting, without really considering whether some of them might be too overpowered or not. Initially, I was simply focused on coming up with a list of roles that I thought could be fun to have in play. Once I had a long list prepared, I then went through it and started removing the ones that could potentially cause balancing issues.
Some of these roles included:
Several of these roles were excluded for balancing reasons. The Forger almost made it into the final setup because, at one point, I considered implementing a last will system. With that system, eliminated players would have been able to write a final message that could be revealed at some point after their elimination. However, it was a feature that I ultimately decided to scrap.
MAFIA
The Strengthener Godfather was initially going to be the Forger Godfather.
The Ninja Roleblocker started out simply as a Roleblocker, but I wanted to add an inherent risk to certain roles (for example, the Neighborizer adding Mafia to their Neighbourhood, or the Alignment Cop with the Godfather). Since the Tracker and Motion Detector were existing, I wanted the Ninja to add a similar inherent risk. Unfortunately, the Tracker died early on, and the Motion Detector was never used due to inactivity.
The Role Cop was one of the role that I decided on very quickly. It felt like a no-brainer for the mafia to have a least one role reveal ability.
The Shapeshifter role was decided very late in development, mostly because I was not even sure what to give for the fourth mafia player. I considered the Bomber or Strengthener before assigning the latter to the Godfather, mostly because I wanted all four mafia players to have utility roles. At one point, it almost became the Framer Shapeshifter. However, looking back at feedback from the post-revival mafia games, I remembered that the Framer hadn't been very successful in Pokémon Masters Mafia. I scrapped the Framer role and ultimately went with the Shapeshifter. One thing I would do differently now is to have the Shapeshifter only copy the role of another player without changing alignment, because I agree that having two mafia roles with hidden alignment was too much.
Overall, I built the mafia team so that they had some strong enough roles to effectively face the town. I wanted to avoid a situation similar to Pokémon Masters Mafia, where the mafia ended up unable to do much by the end of the game. Even if the mafia lost one or two players, I wanted the team to remain solid and capable of holding their own.
TOWN
The Firebug role was added very late in development, mainly to create an ability that could target Location Roles. Honestly, I wasn't a fan of this role, even from the start of the game. I had considered implementing some kind of Location Blocker (similar to the Roleblocker), but because most Location Role abilities were situational, I felt it would only work with the Silencer, and that didn't seem like a good fit either. This role could potentially be reworked into something else, or it might not even be necessary at all. The Firebug came in as a replacement for the Commuter role, which was one of the roles that almost made it into the game.
Initially, the Bulletproof role wouldn't know if they had been targeted by a kill. However, after reading Revin's feedback from Toad Brigade Mafia, I decided to change it so that they would be informed of such occurrence.
The Jailkeeper came into existence mostly because I was not really interested in just having a vanilla town roleblocker, and I think it did worked out pretty well in this game, especially when the mafia was really wondering why they couldn't target Coco. That said, there's been a miscommunication with how I was informing Nine with his Strengthener ability, so that's something I want to be more careful going forward.
The Neigborizer was easily my favorite addition. It came about because I remembered the mixed feeling reactions we had with post-revival mafia games where town players couldn't communicate with each other. When I first planned Rogues in Rogueport 2 in 2023, adding a way for town players to communicate was something I definitely wanted to include. For the newer version, I was juggling between several options: creating an event that allowed communication for a single night, or adding Masons (or a Masonizer). Ultimately, the Neighborizer, with its inherent risk of potentially communicating with the mafia, felt like the best choice. I agree with Rose's sentiment, I believe this is a gameplay element that should definitely become a staple going forward.
LOCATION ROLES
I initially considered having the Janitor instead of the Governor. Honestly, I'm not even sure if including that role was even a good idea, since it felt extremely situational. I could be wrong, but if I were to remake this game, I might consider something entirely different.
The Public Speaker badge was a leftover from the precursor to the Location Roles. Initially, the known roles would have been in the form of badges. When I was still planning the map system in the original version of RiR2, badges were meant to be scattered around the areas and players would collect them by exploring the map. All of that was eventually scrapped in favour of having simpler Location Role, which I felt made the general presentation more interesting overall. Since Rogueport serves as a hub world with many facilities, it felt more fun to have the locations in play as if players were actually inhabiting Rogueport itself.
I agree with Roserade's assessment of the Location Giver role, and the Wandering Player system. I feel the way players could interact with locations or gain access to them could have been more interesting overall. Perhaps it would have been better to give Wandering Players some form of utility, instead of having them without any abilities or purpose.
EVENTS
Some ideas that I ended up scrapping:
Also, Curse guy mostly happened as an accident. I initially intended on only having the special event message I was adding at the start of each Day phase, but I wanted to do something a bit more interesting to present the gimmick each cycle, and the curse guy from TTYD felt very fitting with that specific narrative so I went with it.
Initially, the selection of events was planned differently. I once considered making it a role power badge given to one player, who would then select the events. However, since I wanted events to occur throughout the game, that approach wouldn't have worked as a role ability. In the original RiR2, it would have been up to the eliminated players to choose the events. For the newer version, I decided to rely on RNG instead due to situations where no eliminations could occurred, like what happened on Day 1.
OTHER STUFF
I initially planned the Day and Night phases to be named as Chapters to give a closer presentation similar to TTYD. So, instead of naming the Day and Night cycles as Day 1, Night 1, it would have been Chapter 1 Day, Chapter 1 Night. I decided against doing it in order to keep this simpler.
Unless I missed something, I think this is pretty much all I wanted to cover.
For the original version of Rogues in Rogueport 2, the intention was to have Sticky Warrior and Ms. Mowz as antagonists possessed by the Crystal Stars. Their soul would have been imprisoned within the Crystal Stars leaving them being corrupted by a similar process to what I did with Grodus who became Sir Yux. I think I also wanted to give little hints that other characters from the original RiR might have been in imprisoned in the other Crystal Stars. I was also considering giving some more lore about Sticky Warrior and from where he came from (such as his real name). Since the game ended up being cancelled, several of those ideas later became used in the Triple Trouble story arc of Shmaluigi, Private Investigator.
Overall, the characters of Sir Yux and Johnson stayed relatively the same compared to the original concept. At one point, I even considered using a map system where Sticky and Ms. Mowz would perform certain actions during the night on behalf of the mafia. In the end, I scrapped that system entirely during the development of the original RiR2.
While working on the newer version of Rogues in Rogueport 2, I decided to phase out Sticky and Ms. Mowz and instead focus on a simpler story centred around the Dark Crystal Star. The decision to remove them from the main narrative and keep them only as easter eggs referencing the original game was made so that Rogues in Rogueport 2 could have its own identity, rather than feeling just like a direct follow-up to the first Rogues in Rogueport.
I also think I initially intended to follow a similar story structure to the first game with RiR2. However, I ultimately chose to keep things more simplistic here in order to give players more freedom to build their own narrative through their role-play. This way, they could develop their own stories and interactions instead of relying on a narrative already been built for them in advance, like the first game.
POWER ROLES
Okay, the roles used during this game went through a long process. At first, I had fun creating a list of roles that I thought were interesting, without really considering whether some of them might be too overpowered or not. Initially, I was simply focused on coming up with a list of roles that I thought could be fun to have in play. Once I had a long list prepared, I then went through it and started removing the ones that could potentially cause balancing issues.
Some of these roles included:
- Watcher: A player that could learn which players targeted that same player as the Watcher.
- Janitor: A player that could prevent revealing the role and alignment of a player if that player died.
- Forger: A player that could rewrite the last will* of another player.
- Burglar: A player that could steal another player's role permanently.
- Bomber: A player that could eliminate another player when eliminated during Day phase.
- Little Girl: A player that could received randomly selected sentence from mafia chat.
- Loudmouth: A player that could cause revealing the name of everyone visiting them during Night phases.
- Leader: A player that could cause every votes to be anonymous during the next Day phase if ever eliminated.
- Bystander: A player that would always show up to the Tracker.
- Commuter: A player that could « leave » the town, thus making them unable to be targeted by night actions.
Several of these roles were excluded for balancing reasons. The Forger almost made it into the final setup because, at one point, I considered implementing a last will system. With that system, eliminated players would have been able to write a final message that could be revealed at some point after their elimination. However, it was a feature that I ultimately decided to scrap.
MAFIA
The Strengthener Godfather was initially going to be the Forger Godfather.
The Ninja Roleblocker started out simply as a Roleblocker, but I wanted to add an inherent risk to certain roles (for example, the Neighborizer adding Mafia to their Neighbourhood, or the Alignment Cop with the Godfather). Since the Tracker and Motion Detector were existing, I wanted the Ninja to add a similar inherent risk. Unfortunately, the Tracker died early on, and the Motion Detector was never used due to inactivity.
The Role Cop was one of the role that I decided on very quickly. It felt like a no-brainer for the mafia to have a least one role reveal ability.
The Shapeshifter role was decided very late in development, mostly because I was not even sure what to give for the fourth mafia player. I considered the Bomber or Strengthener before assigning the latter to the Godfather, mostly because I wanted all four mafia players to have utility roles. At one point, it almost became the Framer Shapeshifter. However, looking back at feedback from the post-revival mafia games, I remembered that the Framer hadn't been very successful in Pokémon Masters Mafia. I scrapped the Framer role and ultimately went with the Shapeshifter. One thing I would do differently now is to have the Shapeshifter only copy the role of another player without changing alignment, because I agree that having two mafia roles with hidden alignment was too much.
Overall, I built the mafia team so that they had some strong enough roles to effectively face the town. I wanted to avoid a situation similar to Pokémon Masters Mafia, where the mafia ended up unable to do much by the end of the game. Even if the mafia lost one or two players, I wanted the team to remain solid and capable of holding their own.
TOWN
The Firebug role was added very late in development, mainly to create an ability that could target Location Roles. Honestly, I wasn't a fan of this role, even from the start of the game. I had considered implementing some kind of Location Blocker (similar to the Roleblocker), but because most Location Role abilities were situational, I felt it would only work with the Silencer, and that didn't seem like a good fit either. This role could potentially be reworked into something else, or it might not even be necessary at all. The Firebug came in as a replacement for the Commuter role, which was one of the roles that almost made it into the game.
Initially, the Bulletproof role wouldn't know if they had been targeted by a kill. However, after reading Revin's feedback from Toad Brigade Mafia, I decided to change it so that they would be informed of such occurrence.
The Jailkeeper came into existence mostly because I was not really interested in just having a vanilla town roleblocker, and I think it did worked out pretty well in this game, especially when the mafia was really wondering why they couldn't target Coco. That said, there's been a miscommunication with how I was informing Nine with his Strengthener ability, so that's something I want to be more careful going forward.
The Neigborizer was easily my favorite addition. It came about because I remembered the mixed feeling reactions we had with post-revival mafia games where town players couldn't communicate with each other. When I first planned Rogues in Rogueport 2 in 2023, adding a way for town players to communicate was something I definitely wanted to include. For the newer version, I was juggling between several options: creating an event that allowed communication for a single night, or adding Masons (or a Masonizer). Ultimately, the Neighborizer, with its inherent risk of potentially communicating with the mafia, felt like the best choice. I agree with Rose's sentiment, I believe this is a gameplay element that should definitely become a staple going forward.
LOCATION ROLES
I initially considered having the Janitor instead of the Governor. Honestly, I'm not even sure if including that role was even a good idea, since it felt extremely situational. I could be wrong, but if I were to remake this game, I might consider something entirely different.
The Public Speaker badge was a leftover from the precursor to the Location Roles. Initially, the known roles would have been in the form of badges. When I was still planning the map system in the original version of RiR2, badges were meant to be scattered around the areas and players would collect them by exploring the map. All of that was eventually scrapped in favour of having simpler Location Role, which I felt made the general presentation more interesting overall. Since Rogueport serves as a hub world with many facilities, it felt more fun to have the locations in play as if players were actually inhabiting Rogueport itself.
I agree with Roserade's assessment of the Location Giver role, and the Wandering Player system. I feel the way players could interact with locations or gain access to them could have been more interesting overall. Perhaps it would have been better to give Wandering Players some form of utility, instead of having them without any abilities or purpose.
EVENTS
Some ideas that I ended up scrapping:
- An event that could have given the ability to a player to communicate with eliminated players.
- An event that could allow every living players to make use of roles that eliminated players had for one night. (This one would have been put into effect only close to the endgame)
- An event that allowed players to read the last will of eliminated players.
Also, Curse guy mostly happened as an accident. I initially intended on only having the special event message I was adding at the start of each Day phase, but I wanted to do something a bit more interesting to present the gimmick each cycle, and the curse guy from TTYD felt very fitting with that specific narrative so I went with it.
Initially, the selection of events was planned differently. I once considered making it a role power badge given to one player, who would then select the events. However, since I wanted events to occur throughout the game, that approach wouldn't have worked as a role ability. In the original RiR2, it would have been up to the eliminated players to choose the events. For the newer version, I decided to rely on RNG instead due to situations where no eliminations could occurred, like what happened on Day 1.
OTHER STUFF
I initially planned the Day and Night phases to be named as Chapters to give a closer presentation similar to TTYD. So, instead of naming the Day and Night cycles as Day 1, Night 1, it would have been Chapter 1 Day, Chapter 1 Night. I decided against doing it in order to keep this simpler.
Unless I missed something, I think this is pretty much all I wanted to cover.