Stage Legality Discussion Thread

[GalacticPetey]

That's not why Melee is loved in the competitive scene. It's remembered for the gameplay. If Smash 4 had its current roster plus Melee's gameplay, both parties would be happy.

 

[Baby Mario Bloops]

That's not why Melee is loved in the competitive scene. It's remembered for the gameplay. If Smash 4 had its current roster plus Melee's gameplay, both parties would be happy.

So basically you're saying that both parties aren't happy unless it's Melee?

 

[GalacticPetey]

No. I love all Smash games. Gameplay similar to Melee wouldn't hut any casual play and would benefit competitive players. I see no reason not to do it.

 

[Baby Mario Bloops]

No. I love all Smash games. Gameplay similar to Melee wouldn't hut any casual play and would benefit competitive players. I see no reason not to do it.

I don't like that mindset, because it basically is saying "casuals don't care, so do whatever the competitive players want", even though - as you mentioned earlier - that a majority of the people that get the game are casual players.

Sakurai understands who his target audience is, combined with the fact that he doesn't want it to become a sports (even though it will have it's competitive side), which is why he probably doesn't want it too much for the competitive players and more on just having fun battling as your favorite characters.

So yeah, I do see a lot of reasons why he wouldn't do it.

 

[Crackin355]

Back to the topic at hand; having four players removes some stage hazards so Reset Bomb Factory could be a Doubles counter pick. That would be cool, it makes the environments indestructible and gets rid of the monster at the bottom.

 

[GalacticPetey]

No. I love all Smash games. Gameplay similar to Melee wouldn't hut any casual play and would benefit competitive players. I see no reason not to do it.

I don't like that mindset, because it basically is saying "casuals don't care, so do whatever the competitive players want", even though - as you mentioned earlier - that a majority of the people that get the game are casual players.

Sakurai understands who his target audience is, combined with the fact that he doesn't want it to become a sports (even though it will have it's competitive side), which is why he probably doesn't want it too much for the competitive players and more on just having fun battling as your favorite characters.

So yeah, I do see a lot of reasons why he wouldn't do it.

So the competitive community should just be ignored?

 

[Zae]

No. I love all Smash games. Gameplay similar to Melee wouldn't hut any casual play and would benefit competitive players. I see no reason not to do it.

I don't like that mindset, because it basically is saying "casuals don't care, so do whatever the competitive players want", even though - as you mentioned earlier - that a majority of the people that get the game are casual players.

Sakurai understands who his target audience is, combined with the fact that he doesn't want it to become a sports (even though it will have it's competitive side), which is why he probably doesn't want it too much for the competitive players and more on just having fun battling as your favorite characters.

So yeah, I do see a lot of reasons why he wouldn't do it.

So the competitive community should just be ignored?

quite impossible. As long as smash continues to be a fighting game, there will always be a competitive scene.

 

[Kong Rong]

No. I love all Smash games. Gameplay similar to Melee wouldn't hut any casual play and would benefit competitive players. I see no reason not to do it.

I don't like that mindset, because it basically is saying "casuals don't care, so do whatever the competitive players want", even though - as you mentioned earlier - that a majority of the people that get the game are casual players.

Sakurai understands who his target audience is, combined with the fact that he doesn't want it to become a sports (even though it will have it's competitive side), which is why he probably doesn't want it too much for the competitive players and more on just having fun battling as your favorite characters.

So yeah, I do see a lot of reasons why he wouldn't do it.

So the competitive community should just be ignored?

Yep fuck em

 

[Lumastar]

Back to the topic at hand; having four players removes some stage hazards so Reset Bomb Factory could be a Doubles counter pick. That would be cool, it makes the environments indestructible and gets rid of the monster at the bottom.

You bring up a good point, but the extremely campy nature of the second half is something to consider. Maybe a counterpick?

 

[Xiahou Dun]

I'm not ignorant; I know the competitive scene. I just gave my opinion. If you don't like my opinion, well then oh well. You can't just walk in though saying that I'm ignorant and that my analogy is awful and then not say anything else.

It's a misinformed opinion then. The analogy is awful because stages being banned and characters being banned are two different things. Stages have much more potential of overcentralizing the gameplay and turning the gameplay into a campfest. Characters, on the other hand, require grasping the fundamentals of their moveset and take quite some time to fully master. You can tell a difference between the time I've invested with Mario compared to Pikachu even though I'm an overall super-experienced Smash player. Characters do get broken, and they get banned the same reason stages get banned: they're unhealthy for the competitive community.

People and even I can argue that stage hazards are skill-based as it requires exploitation, but in the end, the incessant relying on exploiting stage hazards overcentralizes the game and it's not really a matter of skill. It discourages people from experimenting and using different tactics and rewards cheap tactics. There are stages with hazards that are allowed, but I think the motives for banning certain stages in tournaments are reasonable. I still think, however, transforming each stage into a Final Destination variant is laughable and exposes the ignorance of the developers when it comes to the competitive community.

No. I love all Smash games. Gameplay similar to Melee wouldn't hut any casual play and would benefit competitive players. I see no reason not to do it.

I don't like that mindset, because it basically is saying "casuals don't care, so do whatever the competitive players want", even though - as you mentioned earlier - that a majority of the people that get the game are casual players.

Sakurai understands who his target audience is, combined with the fact that he doesn't want it to become a sports (even though it will have it's competitive side), which is why he probably doesn't want it too much for the competitive players and more on just having fun battling as your favorite characters.

So yeah, I do see a lot of reasons why he wouldn't do it.

So the competitive community should just be ignored?

quite impossible. As long as smash continues to be a fighting game, there will always be a competitive scene.

Some competitive scenes have more critics than others. Melee is far from perfect, but I don't think it's comparable to the mess that Barlw is.

I don't like that mindset, because it basically is saying "casuals don't care, so do whatever the competitive players want", even though - as you mentioned earlier - that a majority of the people that get the game are casual players.

Casuals do care about their game. It's just that the inner workings of the game doesn't influence them as much. Like, they're not going to argue for the removal of stale move negation as much as competitive players, nor do they mourn the death of wave-dashing and shine dashing as much as the competitive players. They might celebrate the ease of air-dodging and side-stepping because it's apparently improved, although competitive players dislike it because it encourages less aggressive play.

The majority of the Super Smash Bros. players are not competitive, but it isn't like Melee is too difficult to jump in and enjoy it. Melee has the bonus of having the depth required for actual competitive play, which makes it a wonder Sakurai was so reluctant to make Brawl a Melee 2.0.