Abortion: Your Stand

[Crackin355]

I always thought Sperm were just cells. All I know is that in my opinion, as soon as the baby is made, it's alive.

And yes, I noticed you didnt say you were right or wrong, which is good because doing that causes arguments. The topic asked for where we stand, not for whats right and wrong.

 

[ralphfan]

A fetus is also "just cells".

 

[Crackin355]

I guess, but I still stand with not liking abortion.

 

[QuizmoManiac]

i'm veyr conflicted over this topic because on the one hand i hate babies and want them all to die, but on the other hand i wouldn't want women to have rights or anything

Old post and all, but the obvious solution is to force abortion apon them.
Dead babies and no rights.
Do I win?

 

[Scarecrow von Steuben]

You do not have the right to an abortion because your body does not belong to you. It belongs to the Holy Living God.

Now what a *bleep*ed up thing to say. If a pregnancy were to occur and the mother would die if she didn't abort, you can't possibly value something that may or may not actually be human over someone who definitely is. You don't get to pass judgement on her. You don't get to sentence her to death. Her body does belong to her, and your religious fanaticism won't change that. Funny how people like you have done more than any atheist ever could to shake my faith in Christianity.

I used to be obsessively pro-life, I still don't like abortion, but I'm not as obsessive about it as I once was

That's terrifying for several reasons, the foremost of which is this is you not being crazy?

I watched a video on it. A lady worked at a place that said abortion while the baby was early is fine. their enemies who said pregnancy was good were across the road. They were mildly friendly to each other but both were sort of distant. Eventually when the lady had to see the baby and said that it was okay since it wasnt old enough to move, she watched he scan thing and it moved. she'd been lied to about the age babies gain a conciousness and could feel pain. she then turned over a new leaf. So yes, I think abortion is Bad. it is essentially killing, since there is life in that belly.

Bull*bleep*. That's propaganda. There is no proof when or where the fetus gains consciousness. I'm not saying your point is necessarily invalid (we need a hell of a lot more reasonable debate on this and a hell of a lot less psychotic fundamentalism) but that's pretty obviously fake, as there have been virtually no cases of abortion clinics lying about this sort of thing and, as I said earlier, no proof when or where the fetus gains consciousness.



The thing that gets me riled up about this is that from what I've seen, a lot of opponents of abortion are less concerned about the baby and more in scaring teenage girls out of sex. Aside from shutting down abortion clinics, the tea party has been trying to limit access to birth control pills- so that they can basically force women to either never have sex or get pregnant.

Being a teenage male I do not approve.

 

[Brock]

When I picture this topic, I picture Scarecrow's siggy. And that's how I picture scarecrow in this thread. Dancing around in glee.

Infact, I shall post my image of scarecrow in this thread.

 

[Scarecrow von Steuben]

And that's how I picture scarecrow in this thread. Dancing around in glee.

You are entirely accurate! I am dancing around with glee at this moment, and typing with one hand.

 

[vvooper]

I would just like to interject and state my opinion on the subject, which is that I'm against abortion unless a pregnancy is a severe health risk to the mother. In cases of rape, etc., it's fine if the mother puts the kid up for adoption if she doesn't want it, but it doesn't justify killing her child.

 

[Scarecrow von Steuben]

I would just like to interject and state my opinion on the subject, which is that I'm against abortion unless a pregnancy is a severe health risk to the mother. In cases of rape, etc., it's fine if the mother puts the kid up for adoption if she doesn't want it, but it doesn't justify killing her child.

That seems like a fair enough view. I think the reason why abortion occurs instead of adoption is because of how intensely painful childbirth is.

 

[Zero777]

And incest babies don't always turn out retarded.

Wrong, they do ALWAYS turn out retarded. Incest causes refinement of traits and genetic problems, causing retardation.

So, if you count the fetus as being alive, how old would an aborted fetus be at the time of death? We don't count birth at the time of conception. We count it from when the baby leaves the mother's body.

Some countries do count the child's age before they are delivered. To answer your neutral question: Age is like the terms "cold" and "immediately", they are made up terms made by humans to make comprehending aspects of life easier. I say this because most people think that the body grows at a constant speed, but this isn't true since there are some times in your life where your body will develop faster in one year than another year. Age should be based on a person's body development, not a timer that starts when the baby completely exits the mother's vagina to when the person's heart and brain stop working and is unable to get it back working by itself or by other's help. How would this system work? I have no clue, so that's why we use an earth year to flag, bookmark, or keep track of a person's development, even though the amount of development is different each year, it's just simpler to use.

I always thought Sperm were just cells. All I know is that in my opinion, as soon as the baby is made, it's alive.

Sperm is just a cell, it's not living since it's missing at least one characteristic of being alive, but once it comes in contact of the egg cell, forming a zygote, it's technically alive. Like I have mentioned, abortions happen when the fetus is already a few months in development and by that time it's already living.

Bull*bleep*. That's propaganda. There is no proof when or where the fetus gains consciousness. I'm not saying your point is necessarily invalid (we need a hell of a lot more reasonable debate on this and a hell of a lot less psychotic fundamentalism) but that's pretty obviously fake, as there have been virtually no cases of abortion clinics lying about this sort of thing and, as I said earlier, no proof when or where the fetus gains consciousness.



The thing that gets me riled up about this is that from what I've seen, a lot of opponents of abortion are less concerned about the baby and more in scaring teenage girls out of sex. Aside from shutting down abortion clinics, the tea party has been trying to limit access to birth control pills- so that they can basically force women to either never have sex or get pregnant.

Being a teenage male I do not approve.

Well the debate is not weather or not if a fetus is conscious, it's whether or not if the fetus is actually alive and living. If people are killing fetuses because they think it doesn't have a conscious then it would be alright to kill patients in the hospital who are brain dead.

About the second part, yes that makes me incredibly irate that pro-life groups make little efforts/arguments against abortion proportional to size in the acts of scaring and forcing teenage girls not to have sex. That is not there job, that is the parents job to talk about it with their daughter. In reality, it's okay to have a child before marriage, having a baby is about being physically, mentally, emotionally, and financially committed, but marriage does sort of back that up. Shutting down public facilities and not having birth control pills ready is first unconstitutional, it stands against the Bill of Rights, and second, it will be killing the economy more. Next-day pills or birth control pills should be ready to give at a local clinic, why do you (I'm not only talking to Scarecrow) think that birth control were made in the first place? To keep having sex (yes I use the big "s" so what) without using a condom and not having the risk of impregnating her, because you know what, I am going to say it, sex is awesome, all of you will find out sooner or later if you haven't done it yet.

Being a teenage male, I also do not approve of these arrogant actions.

You do not have the right to an abortion because your body does not belong to you. It belongs to the Holy Living God.

Because so many people on this forums are Christian extremists who would agree with that.

Exactly </sarcasm>, we were just having a friendly logical debate whether or not abortion is the killing of a living baby, but then somebody had to bring in religion. I don't give a damn what the pope's one short simple illogical sentence stand on abortion is, expecting us to listen and follow him, bull shit.

That seems like a fair enough view. I think the reason why abortion occurs instead of adoption is because of how intensely painful childbirth is.

I know this is a bit offensive and shallow since I am a male to say this but, they just have to get over it, pain happens, and that kind of pain doesn't stay with them forever. In all delivery cases, when the mother is finish with however painful the delivery was, they are overwhelmed with joy from hearing and/or seeing their baby, not feeling the pain anymore. Giving birth is not like in the movies where the mother is wailing, screaming in pain while pushing the baby out and it's incredibly bloody and long, no, the usual delivery takes no more than 1-3 minutes and there's usually no screaming involved. Plus, there are free parenting classes that will prepare the mother physically and mentally on pushing a baby out just up to their shoulders (That's the widest part; after that the doctors just pulls the baby out). And there are alternative ways to give birth, like C-section (which are usually not dangerous, but requires different procedures and care) and mineral water jacuzzi birth (and no, the baby will not drown from being given birth underwater, as long as the umbilical cord is attached, they will be fine).

 

[Scarecrow von Steuben]

In all delivery cases, when the mother is finish with however painful the delivery was, they are overwhelmed with joy from hearing and/or seeing their baby, not feeling the pain anymore.

Oh yes. I can only imagine the joy of enduring agony to bring to life a child who you had in the first place because you were raped.

 

[NintendoQueen814]

In all delivery cases, when the mother is finish with however painful the delivery was, they are overwhelmed with joy from hearing and/or seeing their baby, not feeling the pain anymore.

Oh yes. I can only imagine the joy of enduring agony to bring to life a child who you had in the first place because you were raped.

It's not the child's fault. But I do see your point.

 

[Crackin355]

The documentary was true story apparently, but this was all from the ladies perspective.

And I believe if the abortion needs to be done to save the mother, it's alright.

And not everybody are christians. I'm christian, but I didn't really know much on the matter until a couple of weeks ago. I mean, I don't think abortion should happen but really, it's the mother's choice.

My opinion is probably invalid or 'wrong' but I'll just stick to it for now.

 

[Marwikedor]

I would just like to interject and state my opinion on the subject, which is that I'm against abortion unless a pregnancy is a severe health risk to the mother. In cases of rape, etc., it's fine if the mother puts the kid up for adoption if she doesn't want it, but it doesn't justify killing her child.

That seems like a fair enough view. I think the reason why abortion occurs instead of adoption is because of how intensely painful childbirth is.

Oh no! A lifetime of living with what she's done and multitudes of health risks over an hour or two of labor pain! The choice is a no brainer. But I shouldn't be talking because Im one of the guilty ones, I voted No when I should have voted Yes because I didn't read it properly and thought No was the anti-abort vote. Think about it like this: Abhortion doesnt just kill one child, it kills generations of children. Generations and generations erased from the gene pool. From a secular standpoint, one of them might have changed the world for the better. A lot of people here in America, the land of opportunity, have risen from the slums and made something out of themselves. I have learned the most proponents of abortion are extremely racist, because they know how many more black and hispanic kids there would be were it not for abortion. You don't have to do much research into the history of Planned Parenthood to see I'm right as usual.

 

[Mario4Ever]

I would just like to interject and state my opinion on the subject, which is that I'm against abortion unless a pregnancy is a severe health risk to the mother. In cases of rape, etc., it's fine if the mother puts the kid up for adoption if she doesn't want it, but it doesn't justify killing her child.

That seems like a fair enough view. I think the reason why abortion occurs instead of adoption is because of how intensely painful childbirth is.

Oh no! A lifetime of living with what she's done and multitudes of health risks over an hour or two of labor pain! The choice is a no brainer. But I shouldn't be talking because Im one of the guilty ones, I voted No when I should have voted Yes because I didn't read it properly and thought No was the anti-abort vote. Think about it like this: Abhortion doesnt just kill one child, it kills generations of children. Generations and generations erased from the gene pool. From a secular standpoint, one of them might have changed the world for the better. A lot of people here in America, the land of opportunity, have risen from the slums and made something out of themselves. I have learned the most proponents of abortion are extremely racist, because they know how many more black and hispanic kids there would be were it not for abortion. You don't have to do much research into the history of Planned Parenthood to see I'm right as usual.

I'm laughing so fucking hard right now...just stop.

 

[Scarecrow von Steuben]

I would just like to interject and state my opinion on the subject, which is that I'm against abortion unless a pregnancy is a severe health risk to the mother. In cases of rape, etc., it's fine if the mother puts the kid up for adoption if she doesn't want it, but it doesn't justify killing her child.

That seems like a fair enough view. I think the reason why abortion occurs instead of adoption is because of how intensely painful childbirth is.

Oh no! A lifetime of living with what she's done and multitudes of health risks over an hour or two of labor pain! The choice is a no brainer. But I shouldn't be talking because Im one of the guilty ones, I voted No when I should have voted Yes because I didn't read it properly and thought No was the anti-abort vote. Think about it like this: Abhortion doesnt just kill one child, it kills generations of children. Generations and generations erased from the gene pool. From a secular standpoint, one of them might have changed the world for the better. A lot of people here in America, the land of opportunity, have risen from the slums and made something out of themselves. I have learned the most proponents of abortion are extremely racist, because they know how many more black and hispanic kids there would be were it not for abortion. You don't have to do much research into the history of Planned Parenthood to see I'm right as usual.

...HAHAHAHAHAHAHA


1. It's infinitely more racist of you to assume that all mothers who have abortions are black or hispanic.

2. Right "as usual" oh my gosh were you raised in a cave or something

3. You're Rudnicki, aren't you?

 

[Crackin355]

"I'm Right" = Stuck Up, Jackass
"Just my Opinion = Respectable, Mature

I think I know which one he is. Do you?

 

[Zero777]

In all delivery cases, when the mother is finish with however painful the delivery was, they are overwhelmed with joy from hearing and/or seeing their baby, not feeling the pain anymore.

Oh yes. I can only imagine the joy of enduring agony to bring to life a child who you had in the first place because you were raped.

I was referring to a planned pregnancy, we're humans, not locust (who got that reference?), but I get what you are saying, but like I referred earlier the reason/logic behind abortion to a rape child doesn't make sense. I don't blame them since they were just rapped and emotions overwhelm them and shut them up from doing anything beside the easiest for them of getting an abortion. Just let the rape child born and give it up for adoption or just take a simple therapy class that can overcome those terrible emotions and see the bright side of it.

@Marwikedor: Your... well I'm not sure what were you trying to do is inaccurate (labor doesn't last for even an hour, you should of read my last post) and incredibly embarrassing to the point that really make us question your age.

 

[ralphfan]

I'm right as usual.

ahahahahahahahaha

You are so fucking stupid.

 

[Pokemon DP]

"Just my Opinion = Respectable, Mature

Only sometimes. When you make a bold, confident statement on an important issue, you damn well better be ready to source your shit and cite some facts, or "just my opinion" will seem like you're talking out of your ass and are trying to avoid defending your claims with proper arguments.

 

[Mario4Ever]

In all delivery cases, when the mother is finish with however painful the delivery was, they are overwhelmed with joy from hearing and/or seeing their baby, not feeling the pain anymore.

Oh yes. I can only imagine the joy of enduring agony to bring to life a child who you had in the first place because you were raped.

I was referring to a planned pregnancy, we're humans, not locust (who got that reference?), but I get what you are saying, but like I referred earlier the reason/logic behind abortion to a rape child doesn't make sense. I don't blame them since they were just rapped and emotions overwhelm them and shut them up from doing anything beside the easiest for them of getting an abortion. Just let the rape child born and give it up for adoption or just take a simple therapy class that can overcome those terrible emotions and see the bright side of it.

@Marwikedor: Your... well I'm not sure what were you trying to do is inaccurate (labor doesn't last for even an hour, you should of read my last post) and incredibly embarrassing to the point that really make us question your age.

I'm pretty sure that no amount of therapy is going to convince a woman who is raped that there is a "bright side" to it.

 

[Crackin355]

"Just my Opinion = Respectable, Mature

Only sometimes. When you make a bold, confident statement on an important issue, you damn well better be ready to source your shit and cite some facts, or "just my opinion" will seem like you're talking out of your ass and are trying to avoid defending your claims with proper arguments.

I was referring to the part of your opinion where it's backed up atleast. Just saying it's your opinion doesn't really work all the time.

But I still stick to what I think on the issue. Maybe when I get older I'll look into it a bit more.

 

[Scarecrow von Steuben]

I was referring to a planned pregnancy, we're humans, not locust (who got that reference?), but I get what you are saying, but like I referred earlier the reason/logic behind abortion to a rape child doesn't make sense. I don't blame them since they were just rapped and emotions overwhelm them and shut them up from doing anything beside the easiest for them of getting an abortion. Just let the rape child born and give it up for adoption or just take a simple therapy class that can overcome those terrible emotions and see the bright side of it.

Imagine that the girl is twelve.

 

[Crackin355]

I thought there was some kind of thing that made it so you can't get pregnant at a young age, but once puberty starts you can. It was something like that, can't remember where I heard it. I'm probably wrong but I'm just saying it just in case.

 

[Mario4Ever]

I was referring to a planned pregnancy, we're humans, not locust (who got that reference?), but I get what you are saying, but like I referred earlier the reason/logic behind abortion to a rape child doesn't make sense. I don't blame them since they were just rapped and emotions overwhelm them and shut them up from doing anything beside the easiest for them of getting an abortion. Just let the rape child born and give it up for adoption or just take a simple therapy class that can overcome those terrible emotions and see the bright side of it.

Imagine that the girl is twelve.

fixed