Author Topic: Bad games with good ideas  (Read 421 times)

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Bad games with good ideas
« on: May 06, 2019, 11:07:56 PM »
Sometimes, a game is just plain out not good, however, if we were to take something from them for a better game, what would you pick? Personally, I would take the Heroic Brutallties from Mortal Kombat vs DC Universe as an alternate style for characters that are too heroic to kill in the main Mortal Kombat games
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Uniju

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Re: Bad games with good ideas
« Reply #1 on: May 06, 2019, 11:23:34 PM »
bad game: all jrpgs and vns
good idea: cute girls
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YoshiFlutterJump

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Re: Bad games with good ideas
« Reply #2 on: May 06, 2019, 11:25:59 PM »
Hey, Rise of Lyric's multiplayer was a good idea...

But it's my least favorite game I've played for a reason.

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Re: Bad games with good ideas
« Reply #3 on: May 07, 2019, 08:45:15 AM »
bad game: all jrpgs and vns
good idea: cute girls

Here's a little something.

How about.

We make a Mario JRPG?

And have it developed by Square?
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Re: Bad games with good ideas
« Reply #4 on: May 07, 2019, 09:53:17 AM »
I've never played Sonic 2006, and from the looks of it, that's a good thing, but the story sounds good and the plot is ok.
except for the world's most awkward kiss...

YoshiFlutterJump

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Re: Bad games with good ideas
« Reply #5 on: May 07, 2019, 10:36:51 AM »
bad game: all jrpgs and vns
good idea: cute girls

Here's a little something.

How about.

We make a Mario JRPG?

And have it developed by Square?
Well, that turned out okay.  Could have actually been great if the battles were more fun and they got rid of all those tedious maze areas.

But still, it brought Mallow into existence, so I'm glad it happened.

Northern Verve

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Re: Bad games with good ideas
« Reply #6 on: May 07, 2019, 11:42:13 AM »
I've never played Sonic 2006, and from the looks of it, that's a good thing, but the story sounds good and the plot is ok.
except for the world's most awkward kiss...

Eh... not really.

The only quote-on-quote "good" parts of Sonic 06's story is probably Shadow's role in the story. He's a government agent in Sonic 06 following the events of the Shadow spin-off game who finds the scepter that contains Mephiles and while meeting Eggman accidentally releases him. Mephiles even takes a form similar to Shadow because of later time travel shenanigans where Shadow was also the one to seal him in the first place. In some ways, Sonic 06's story could very well be "Shadow the Hedgehog 2" because all Sonic does up until the final boss is try to protect and save Elise while Silver who is fooled into believing Sonic is the "Iblis Trigger" goes after Sonic to try to prevent the horrible future he lives in. While Shadow is very much involved in the plot and has the most meet-ups with the big bad throughout the story.

I suppose if you're more of a fan of Sonic trying to take things seriously + Shadow the Hedgehog as a character, that could be a way you could find some enjoyment in Sonic 06's story. But even Shadow's story isn't exactly perfect. There are many, many, many reasons Sonic 06 is such a black mark on the franchise's record ever since it came out. It's story is hardly one of the silver linings.

YoshiFlutterJump

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Re: Bad games with good ideas
« Reply #7 on: May 07, 2019, 11:45:45 AM »
I thought the main reason that 06 was so hated was that, no matter how good it may have been, you couldn't even play it because it was rushed to the point of numerous, inevitable, game-breaking glitches.

Northern Verve

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Re: Bad games with good ideas
« Reply #8 on: May 07, 2019, 12:27:21 PM »
I thought the main reason that 06 was so hated was that, no matter how good it may have been, you couldn't even play it because it was rushed to the point of numerous, inevitable, game-breaking glitches.

Glitches were certainly a big point. But Sonic 06 was still generally a mess even beyond the glitches. There are things in Sonic 06 that would have been criticized even if Sonic 06 had been finished in the way it was intended as certainly some design aspects had to have actually been planned. There is no way everything that turned out bad in the game was only because the game was rushed. The entire direction of the game was an attempt at kind of soft rebooting Sonic into a universe where he lives in the real world. That's not a decision that was rushed. That was actually the intention for this game to bring the Sonic franchise from then onward into a more realistic world that could of been easily mistaken for a modern Final Fantasy game at the time despite it really clashing with the cartoon designs of the Sonic characters.

I'm also not so sure what was so rushed of requiring you to do mini tasks in order to progress in the game. The many characters and vehicles you got to use in the game where Sonic and Blaze are the only "fun" characters to use, had to have been planned out though most certainly putting all of those on the shoulder of a rushed development team certainly wouldn't help.

The fact that most enemies had health bars rather then being destroyed by one hit like most Sonic games couldn't exactly have been rushed (To be fair health bars in Sonic started with Sonic Heroes, but then you had two other AI that attacked when you did, thus tripling the attack output which destroyed most small enemies pretty fast. And the reason they added any enemies with large Health bars was to get you to switch to your power type character that can more easily take care of them. Shadow spin-off game had them too but that's actually what made the guns useful despite how criticized they were for having them in a Sonic game in the first place. For the most part you are stuck with having to homing attack enemies constantly in Sonic 06. Or like in Shadow's part of the game where you're forced to used Shadow's button mashing combo in the air a whole lot)

I'm also not sure many of the clear downgrades from the Adventure games could of really been fixed even in a best case scenario. Because it's so odd just how nerfed Spin Dash is or how you can't jump into enemies to hurt them where as in both Adventure 1 and 2 you could do that just fine. Not having an autosave feels more like an oversight problem. And the Mach Speed sections (The autorunning sections where just running into a wall hurts Sonic, so good luck if you're forced to try to stay on a narrow bridge or have to turn) in all their awkwardness had to have been planned out as well.

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Re: Bad games with good ideas
« Reply #9 on: May 07, 2019, 12:37:05 PM »
Sonic Lost World is, based on a lot of people, a bad game even though I don't really share the sentiment. However, I still can mention what I think are the best things going for it:
- The idea of running up walls is really good, as it allows Sonic to run on walls without losing speed, which is something that would be helpful but I felt that it's a bit difficult to control.
- The way homing attack works, in which there is a way to do more damage if the condition is right, plus there are two options in attacking. I felt that the damage-dependent aspect could be based on the distance between Sonic and the target.
- Tube-like levels as a type of 3D level, because it has the breadth of a 3D level while still having some guidance on how to move forward.

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Re: Bad games with good ideas
« Reply #10 on: May 07, 2019, 12:57:40 PM »
Good to know.  Never played 06 (never even owned a console to play it on) but it's nice to have the full story on that game's poor reputation.

Lost World?  I've played both the Wii U and 3DS demos, but I have yet to play the full game.  But from what I've played, it's not so bad.  I'd say it's probably better than Forces.

Northern Verve

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Re: Bad games with good ideas
« Reply #11 on: May 07, 2019, 02:04:40 PM »
I wouldn't call Lost World a bad game necessarily (The Wii U/Steam version anyway, I've heard terrible things about the 3DS version though). Probably not on Colors or Generation quality. But certainly aspects that if given time to improve if they ever made a sequel (Which is unlikely at this point) could of been refined into some good times.

I think the main problem Lost World seemed to have is that it kind of "Mario-fies" Sonic a little too much. Right down to similar level progression similar to New Super Mario Bros. and the Deadly Six essentially being Sonic's own take on the Koopalings. Even requiring you to hold down a button to run faster rather then Sonic being fast by default which is again more akin to a Mario game as opposed to Sonic. All it'd need essentially is Sonic having to save a kidnapped Amy by Eggman and/or the Deadly Six and you'd have essentially a completely Mario-fied Sonic game. And of course that's not even mentioning the Yoshi level DLC heh.

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Re: Bad games with good ideas
« Reply #12 on: May 07, 2019, 05:42:58 PM »
I think lost world in terms of the parkour stuff has the best concept to build off of for a good sonic game. It's just the level design and controls needed to be refined.
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Re: Bad games with good ideas
« Reply #13 on: May 08, 2019, 01:06:29 AM »
assassin's creed unity

it's the mother*bleep*ing french revolution but the combat feels so immensely unsatisfying i dont wanna play it gods why

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Re: Bad games with good ideas
« Reply #14 on: May 08, 2019, 03:11:54 PM »
Darkspore is an okayish game, if I remember correctly, with Diablo like gameplay. But it's unprecedented in how equipment comes in the form of body parts and armor and you have several body types to choose from. It makes for unique character designs you can use rather than play as humans with armor on them. It's literally unplayable today since it requires an internet connection, the servers are gone, and content is stored sercer-side, but there appears to be fan efforts in recreating servers that allow the game to be played today.

I personally love Spore to death but I can see why it can be considered a bad game but it has such amazing ideas. The creature creator deserves to be used in more games, and Spore's interface is fantastic. It's too bad the gameplay of it tends to be extremely pared down. But the best way to enjoy Spore is via expansion pack Galactic Adventures and mods.

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Re: Bad games with good ideas
« Reply #15 on: May 13, 2019, 03:55:03 AM »
A lot of PMSS I would consider good ideas, interesting mechanics

I just didn't think it was executed properly

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Re: Bad games with good ideas
« Reply #16 on: May 14, 2019, 02:53:23 PM »
Despite it's flaws I personally enjoyed Sonic Chronicles: The Dark Brotherhood and would love to see SEGA take another crack at a Sonic RPG.

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Re: Bad games with good ideas
« Reply #17 on: May 14, 2019, 04:01:15 PM »
I honestly think that SCtDB was a fantastic idea as well, I haven't played it yet but I think it would work really well if done correctly