Update the proposal archives

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RAP said:
Wow, now applying it with wiki collaboration does wonders. It really gets users to work together and finish it. Thanks Walkazo for making this happen.

Suggested changes on the proposal entry template:
  • Add a way for color blind users to distinguish proposal templates by adding symbols (particularly Mario icons). I know User:Stooben Rooben is a color-blind user. Welp, didn't bother to read the discussions regarding this, disregard this entry.
  • Space the info within the entries out. I actually tried experimenting and hacking my way to make that work back in 2010, but failed to execute that correctly. Here's the mockup what the proposal entry is supposed to look like and when there are a set of entries: User:RAP/test5 Compare my test page to the current template, and it doesn't look very good in comparison to the mockup.
  • Soften the following colors: red, green, yellow, purple, and orange. I felt it was too bright to look at and doesn't look good as a result.
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While having a bit more space between the components might be handy, seeing as we're not dealing with one table, but separate templates, I'm not sure how easily that could be done. Plus, it looks kinda bad to have gaps that big without vertical rules: there's too much negative space.

I disagree: all the colours seem fine to me (and there was a lot of discussion amongst the admins back when we were selecting the colours; everyone at that point was fine with what we decided on). We're already using dulled out shades for everything, and if we soften some even further, the blocks might start looking too faded out. Oranges and reds especially start to look sucky if you lighten them too much, imho, but right now, we have colours that aren't glaring, yet aren't wussy either, and since everything's about the same brightness, it evens out.
 
@Walkazo: I'm not sure, it looks fine to me (note that it's just a mockup); unless it's about the empty spacing between "Proposal Name" and "Ended". You can distinguish the columns with your mind because they fill them for you. Would it be better to all the stuff shift to the left if hypothetically this is possible?

The one Knife created doesn't seem right. And didn't I did something similar to the mockup I made? Here is the old page (User:RAP/test4/2007a) as an example of my style of organizing the info neatly. Back when the project is still up for being finished, I didn't questioned it because the only redeeming thing is that it's easier to plug in the entries. I should've known the design doesn't look good and discussed with Knife regarding the design aspect of displaying the info. How is this a thing? How is this acceptable and not tables? Everything but this consisting of the assorted data have tables.

As for the colors; I attempted to determine whether I'm tired, Flux (a program that helps your eyes suit to the lighting enviroment so they won't hurt harm them) is interfering with how I perceive colors, or that the color quality in the built-in settings of the monitor is displayed incorrect. Checking that it is not all those three (even though the first one is true but not enough to interfere with that I'm doing), I decided investigate by checking all the colors the Template:PArchive has to see if all of them have the same brightness as you claimed.

After comparing and contrasting the images. Here are the results:

Group 1 (non-offending colors): Blue, Brown, Pink, Purple, Red,
Group 2 (offending colors): Green, Orange, Yellow
Exception: grey (if counted = sort under group 1)

Here is the data to back it up:

Group 1: Blue, Brown, Pink, Purple, Red
Group 2: Green, Orange, Yellow
Exception: Grey

As the color picker shows, there are two different types of brightness occurring which clashes the colors' brightness. Group 1 is untouched because they are set to the desired brightness that it needs without being "in-your-face". Group 2 are the offending colors, the rest are fine. Yellow is so bad that it needs to be changed into Gold. Group 1 is what I targeting it's level of brightness.

Arrrrgh, I'm extra tired tonight. I'm sleeping early; I did something earlier that caused this (and that I had to gather data for this discussion). I'll catch up to this as early as tomorrow, or as late as Wednesday. College finals are approaching.
 
If this collaboration still going? If so, what can I do right now?

Also, shouldn't those proposals be collapsed, if they can? Also, I think the colors should be a little bit more faded. It's a bit easier on the eyes.
 
Yep, it's still going. You can start the 2011 proposals or continue where Tucayo left off with the 2010 archives (this being the next proposal (MarioWiki:Proposals/Archive_22#Whose_Point_of_View_is_it_Anyway.3F)).

RAP said:
@Walkazo: I'm not sure, it looks fine to me (note that it's just a mockup); unless it's about the empty spacing between "Proposal Name" and "Ended". You can distinguish the columns with your mind because they fill them for you. Would it be better to all the stuff shift to the left if hypothetically this is possible?

The one Knife created doesn't seem right. And didn't I did something similar to the mockup I made? Here is the old page (User:RAP/test4/2007a) as an example of my style of organizing the info neatly. Back when the project is still up for being finished, I didn't questioned it because the only redeeming thing is that it's easier to plug in the entries. I should've known the design doesn't look good and discussed with Knife regarding the design aspect of displaying the info. How is this a thing? How is this acceptable and not tables? Everything but this consisting of the assorted data have tables.

As for the colors; I attempted to determine whether I'm tired, Flux (a program that helps your eyes suit to the lighting enviroment so they won't hurt harm them) is interfering with how I perceive colors, or that the color quality in the built-in settings of the monitor is displayed incorrect. Checking that it is not all those three (even though the first one is true but not enough to interfere with that I'm doing), I decided investigate by checking all the colors the Template:PArchive has to see if all of them have the same brightness as you claimed.

After comparing and contrasting the images. Here are the results:

Group 1 (non-offending colors): Blue, Brown, Pink, Purple, Red,
Group 2 (offending colors): Green, Orange, Yellow
Exception: grey (if counted = sort under group 1)

Here is the data to back it up:

Group 1: Blue, Brown, Pink, Purple, Red
Group 2: Green, Orange, Yellow
Exception: Grey

As the color picker shows, there are two different types of brightness occurring which clashes the colors' brightness. Group 1 is untouched because they are set to the desired brightness that it needs without being "in-your-face". Group 2 are the offending colors, the rest are fine. Yellow is so bad that it needs to be changed into Gold. Group 1 is what I targeting it's level of brightness.

Arrrrgh, I'm extra tired tonight. I'm sleeping early; I did something earlier that caused this (and that I had to gather data for this discussion). I'll catch up to this as early as tomorrow, or as late as Wednesday. College finals are approaching.
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The admins approved of these colours - we all discussed them back in 2011/2012, and no one opposed them when the project was revived now. No other users are complaining either - aside from Knife's concerns about colour-blindness, but if that is a valid issue, dimming the colours would probably make it worse, as homogenizing the shades eliminates contrast (and it might even make some of the hues more similar - namely the red, pink, orange and brown group). Also, navigation templates are even more brightly coloured than these, and that scheme was approved by a proposal as well as the admins, suggesting most folks don't have issues with colourfulness. Of course, if other users do take issue with the colours, then we can talk about changing it, but for now, it's staying the same.

And we're not changing the formatting either. Again, the template system has been admin-approved since 2011, and so far, you're the only one who's said they don't like it. It's easy to use, and we've already sunk a lot of effort into implementing it - going back and redoing it all is not something anyone wants to do, methinks. Besides, while I can't speak for anyone but myself, there are a lot of issues with your table there... The blue links look bad against the colours and manually colour-linking each entry would be too complicated. If you get long titles or usernames, that starts to screw around with the column widths, and if the table spans the whole page (which will happen for users with smaller computers, even if you take out the unnecessary start time column) and starts forcing stuff onto the second line, both the "(talk)" and the days get orphaned (the month names should be written out, by the way: it's clearer), which looks sloppy. Also, while at first glance, you'd think being able to reorder the table based on the various columns would be handy, it's actually rather superfluous: the dates will be the same as the numeric order anyway, alphabetical order isn't helpful - you need to search for keywords with ctrl+F to find stuff, and you can search to find users too (it's even better than ordering in some respects since the table can't deal with name changes, whereas you could manually search for the various names and sum everything up as you go). At least, that's what I think.

If I'm wrong and other users hate the colours and the templates, they can speak up, of course. But it's a breath of fresh air to finally get this archiving system off the ground after all these years, and I really think that trying to overhaul it now would be going nowhere but backwards.
 
@Walkazo: For the colours, very well; I guess I'm part of the minority there. I still honestly think it should be changed. I guess I'll get used to it.

As for my table, I wasn't actually saying to use mine over Knife's. I never said that in the previous post at all. I was actually thinking of fusing both the templates Knife and I created separately when this project is finally starting up again. I didn't know those things that you were saying are irritating back then. Alright: just remove the irritating stuff as you said, and change the text color to black. Then put in the best pieces: the ease of punching info into the entries, and looking nicely as a table.

Walkazo said:
If you get long titles or usernames, that starts to screw around with the column widths, and if the table spans the whole page (which will happen for users with smaller computers, even if you take out the unnecessary start time column) and starts forcing stuff onto the second line,
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Okay, that may be a problem. Can you please define users with smaller computers. Do you mean smartphones or weaker computers? Is it the screen resolution? I'm using this nice resolution viewing tool, and was surprised on how it looks under smaller resolution screen sizes; even Sticker (Super Smash Bros. Brawl) looks decent.

I can get to work on doing it if the problems you said are addressed (that includes that specific problem from the quote above).
The problem is that I'm not experienced enough to code such a thing, so I'm going to have to let this go and move on.

I guess that's what I get for not sleeping well at all this week and the latter half of last week. Sorry for the mess.
 
Smaller as in netbooks and other things with narrow screens.

RAP said:
As for my table, I wasn't actually saying to use mine over Knife's. I never said that in the previous post at all. I was actually thinking of fusing both the templates Knife and I created separately when this project is finally starting up again. I didn't know those things that you were saying are irritating back then. Alright: just remove the irritating stuff as you said, and change the text color to black. Then put in the best pieces: the ease of punching info into the entries, and looking nicely as a table.
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You're entitled to your opinion, but I still say what we have now is fine, and seeing as what you're suggesting might not even be possible anyway... It just seems like a waste of energy to fuss about with a perfectly functional template.
 
Sorry for not doing the '11 proposals, it just slipped my mind :P

I'll start tomorrow. Also, can "colour" be changed to "color"? I've seen almost every policy page using American spelling.
 
Ambassador said:
Sorry for not doing the '11 proposals, it just slipped my mind :P

I'll start tomorrow. Also, can "colour" be changed to "color"? I've seen almost every policy page using American spelling.
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It doesn't really matter about the spelling change. I don't see why that bothers you. I really want to do '11 proposals, but I have a lot of school-related stuff that's getting in the way as well.
 
Ambassador said:
Also, can "colour" be changed to "color"? I've seen almost every policy page using American spelling.
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No. The wiki uses British and American spellings on a first-come, first-served basis on both its articles and its policy pages: I wrote this page, so it uses my spelling, whereas pages written by Americans use American spellings. It's more inclusive that way.
 
I'll do the 2011 proposals now, but is there a reason they were left till last?
 
No reason.

I have a couple hours of free time today, so I'll pick up where Tucayo left off with the 2010 archives.
 
In the main archive page, the link to the 30th 2013 proposal, "#30 • Unprotect the Help pages, YoshiKong (ended NA)" link doesn't work.
 
Banon said:
In the main archive page, the link to the 30th 2013 proposal, "#30 • Unprotect the Help pages, YoshiKong (ended NA)" link doesn't work.
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I fixed it; it linked to Archive 33 instead of 32 because it was in April proposals while it was supposed to end in February.
 
So anyway, MarioWiki:Proposals/Archive now has all the past proposals entered in its tables, so I guess this collab itself can now be archived, if a mod will be so kind as to help with the move, please...
 
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