Status of the main toads (Toad, Toadsworth, Toadette) so far?

Dorayaki

King Bowser
Status of the main toads (Toad, Toadsworth, Toadette) so far?

the topic is relevant with fair rosters and main game players, so I avoid some duplicate things here.


Toads could be the most "symbolic" species in Mario world, as you can see them in almost every game when Mario or Peach is there, even those who don't play games to remember the Mario members (Daisy, Birdo etc) must know toads from Mario worlds.

Rather than those species who doesn't have regular representives (Koops for KoopaTroopa etc), as a symbolic species Nintendo designed threee regulars, they're Toad, Toadsworth and Toadette. In the histroy, Toad is one of the most lasting character as Peach's servant, Toadsworth and Toadette are created in GC era for other use of particulars.

But as representives of a symbolic species in the series, did the staff really make them competent? Despite main games where only Mario bros show their mettle, in early spinoffs Toad is not considered as "captain level" and is not playable every time, but a host instead. This makes many later characters (Wario bros, Bowser Jr. etc) players in more time than him.

Since the era of GC, though in a time Toadsworth becomes an NPC handling many things that Toad did, such as guide, host and RPG NPC, but obviously since Wii era, the use of Toadsworth is dropping ---- it's not Toadsworth is replaced by other professionals again (such as MC), but in most times there are no such a role .

For recent main games, there are Toad Brigade in two Galaxy and two generic players in NSMBWii, while weirdly Toad, Toadsworth or Toadette are not either players or major NPCs in these games. In 3D Land, only Toad becomes an NPC though there are multiple toads around the game. After all in the story, the main toads can't be absent as Peach's important relatives.

For spinoffs, in theory if the main taods are not players, they are basically NPCs around the game (an assumptional purpose of creating Toadsworth, who can make Toad playable). But very weird again, the main toads are in neither side, that means they didn't even appear.

Not only those recent rosters can possibly reduce sales, but I'm also confused waht's the staff thinking of NPC and players, in the way they deal with an NPC into nothing left?
 

Koopaul

Cheep Cheep
It comes down to Nintendo not really caring. They care very little about unique characters and more about what the general public recognize. That's why we get Shy Guy as a playable character instead of General Guy from Paper Mario. Only Mario fans remember General Guy, and Nintendo doesn't care about their fans, they care about the average family member. ANd the average family memeber is more likely to recognize a generic Shy Guy than any other. Same applies to Toads.

This was posted from the Mario Party 9 discussion. It somewhat relates to what I'm saying.

that always bugs me with Nintendo is that they always confuse "character" with "species" and end up blurring the lines between them.

We have a Toad species and a Toad character. We have a Yoshi species and a Yoshi character. I think it all comes down to Nintendo not giving a damn. These characters started out as a species first, but because the species became iconic they wanted them to be playable in other games. So instead of making a unique individual to represent the species and stand out from the others, they said "screw it" and just made the species name into a generic character.

And that's exactly what they are doing here with Koopa and Shy Guy. Instead of having a unique Shy Guy or Koopa that would stand out as a character, they just use a generic number from the masses.
 

Magikrazy

Donkey Kong
Koopaul said:
It comes down to Nintendo not really caring. They care very little about unique characters and more about what the general public recognize. That's why we get Shy Guy as a playable character instead of General Guy from Paper Mario. Only Mario fans remember General Guy, and Nintendo doesn't care about their fans, they care about the average family member. ANd the average family memeber is more likely to recognize a generic Shy Guy than any other. Same applies to Toads.

This was posted from the Mario Party 9 discussion. It somewhat relates to what I'm saying.

that always bugs me with Nintendo is that they always confuse "character" with "species" and end up blurring the lines between them.

We have a Toad species and a Toad character. We have a Yoshi species and a Yoshi character. I think it all comes down to Nintendo not giving a damn. These characters started out as a species first, but because the species became iconic they wanted them to be playable in other games. So instead of making a unique individual to represent the species and stand out from the others, they said "screw it" and just made the species name into a generic character.

And that's exactly what they are doing here with Koopa and Shy Guy. Instead of having a unique Shy Guy or Koopa that would stand out as a character, they just use a generic number from the masses.
I don't find that as much of a problem, but it gets annoying sometimes.

Yoshi and Toad are characters, but does that apply when you use an alternate costume on them?

Birdo is shown to be both a girl and a guy. Double Dash implys that they still don't know what gender it is.
Double Dash website said:
Birdo is Yoshi's girlfriend. Or is it his boyfriend?
Kamek is not only an individual character, but the Japanese name for Magikoopa. It's hard to tell if Kamek in Mario Party 9 is really Kamek or a mistranslated Magikoopa.

Now about Toads, it's been a long time since we saw Toadsworth. Toadette ocassionally makes appearances now and then. Toad is the only recurring Toad character that keeps on recurring. All the other Toads (Toadbert aside) have made but one appearance.
 

Toad85

MarioKartRPG
Dorayaki said:
Status of the main toads (Toad, Toadsworth, Toadette) so far?

the topic is relevant with fair rosters and main game players, so I avoid some duplicate things here.
No one cares about your other threads.

Dorayaki said:
Toads could be the most "symbolic" species in Mario world, as you can see them in almost every game when Mario or Peach is there, even those who don't play games to remember the Mario members (Daisy, Birdo etc) must know toads from Mario worlds.
Yeah no shit.

Dorayaki said:
Rather than those species who doesn't have regular representives (Koops for KoopaTroopa etc), as a symbolic species
Wrong discussion.
Dorayaki said:
Nintendo designed three regulars, they're Toad, Toadsworth and Toadette. In the histroy, Toad is one of the most lasting character as Peach's servant, Toadsworth and Toadette are created in GC era for other use of particulars.
Where are you going with this? I am genuinely...
Dorayaki said:
But as representives of a symbolic species in the series, did the staff really make them competent?
...you did not just go there.
Dorayaki said:
Despite main games where only Mario bros show their mettle, in early spinoffs Toad is not considered as "captain level" and is not playable every time, but a host instead. This makes many later characters (Wario bros, Bowser Jr. etc) players in more time than him.
YOU DID NOT JUST FUCKING GO THERE.
Dorayaki said:
Since the era of GC, though in a time Toadsworth becomes an NPC handling many things that Toad did, such as guide, host and RPG NPC, but obviously since Wii era, the use of Toadsworth is dropping ---- it's not Toadsworth is replaced by other professionals again (such as MC), but in most times there are no such a role .
Do we really need such a role? I don't really think it's that big a deal.
Dorayaki said:
For recent main games, there are Toad Brigade in two Galaxy and two generic players in NSMBWii, while weirdly Toad, Toadsworth or Toadette are not either players or major NPCs in these games.
Don't remind me.
Dorayaki said:
In 3D Land, only Toad becomes an NPC though there are multiple toads around the game. After all in the story, the main toads can't be absent as Peach's important relatives.
Since when is Peach a Toad?
Dorayaki said:
For spinoffs, in theory if the main taods are not players, they are basically NPCs around the game (an assumptional purpose of creating Toadsworth, who can make Toad playable).
You're forgetting Mario Kart 64, Wario's Woods, SMB2, etc. Toad was playable, and no Toadsworth was necessary.
Dorayaki said:
But very weird again, the main toads are in neither side, that means they didn't even appear.
News to me. Toad appeared in both Galaxy games and NSMBW, and Toadette was in MKW.
Dorayaki said:
Not only those recent rosters can possibly reduce sales,
FINALLY SOMEONE RECOGNIZES THE THOUSANDS OF TOAD FANS OUT THERE.
Dorayaki said:
but I'm also confused what's the staff thinking of NPC and players, in the way they deal with an NPC into nothing left?
...what do you mean "nothing left?"
 

Yoshiwaker

Star Spirit
Peter Sam said:
Dorayaki said:
Status of the main toads (Toad, Toadsworth, Toadette) so far?

the topic is relevant with fair rosters and main game players, so I avoid some duplicate things here.
No one cares about your other threads.
olook i see some flaming
Peter Sam said:
Dorayaki said:
In 3D Land, only Toad becomes an NPC though there are multiple toads around the game. After all in the story, the main toads can't be absent as Peach's important relatives.
Since when is Peach a Toad?
Peach's grandma is a Toad.
 

Dr. Javelin

Nathan Latsk
Peter Sam said:
Dorayaki said:
But as representives of a symbolic species in the series, did the staff really make them competent?
...you did not just go there.
Observe - the Toad fan. The species is well-known for its overreaction to hate against its most beloved character.
 

Yoshiwaker

Star Spirit
Peter Sam said:
Dorayaki said:
For spinoffs, in theory if the main taods are not players, they are basically NPCs around the game (an assumptional purpose of creating Toadsworth, who can make Toad playable).
You're forgetting Mario Kart 64, Wario's Woods, SMB2, etc. Toad was playable, and no Toadsworth was necessary.
Note that all those games are old, hardly anybody has heard of or played Wario's Woods, and SMB2 sucked.
 

Easmo

Bob-omb
Yoshiwalker said:
Peter Sam said:
Dorayaki said:
For spinoffs, in theory if the main taods are not players, they are basically NPCs around the game (an assumptional purpose of creating Toadsworth, who can make Toad playable).
You're forgetting Mario Kart 64, Wario's Woods, SMB2, etc. Toad was playable, and no Toadsworth was necessary.
Note that all those games are old, hardly anybody has heard of or played Wario's Woods, and SMB2 sucked.


While I agree with you on the fact that obscure games sadly don´t count... smb2 sucking... pff...
 

Dorayaki

King Bowser
Koopaul said:
It comes down to Nintendo not really caring. They care very little about unique characters and more about what the general public recognize. That's why we get Shy Guy as a playable character instead of General Guy from Paper Mario. Only Mario fans remember General Guy, and Nintendo doesn't care about their fans, they care about the average family member. ANd the average family memeber is more likely to recognize a generic Shy Guy than any other. Same applies to Toads.
Species is a common problem, but I think toads have a contradictive problem in their position of NPC and player, different from other species.
The only surprising thing would be that the staff made Lakitu in Kart 7.

BTW in Paper series, I remember Gourmet Guy more. :P

Loganofan20 said:
No one cares about your other threads.

Do we really need such a role? I don't really think it's that big a deal.
Really? Then thanks for your replies. :P

Do we really need such a role? It's not a request of most fans, bcause the staff already make those hosts and NPC in each series of spinoffs. Personally I guess hosts do have some effects to guide new players.
In Mario's history. each recent Party has one host, Toad and Cream as referees in Olympics, and lakitus for some ball games and Karts. Only baseball has less needs of NPC. In most games, toads are sidekicks of all kinds of games.

BTW, I'm litte surpried to know you don't care Toad playable. :eek:
 

Toad85

MarioKartRPG
Dorayaki said:
BTW, I'm litte surpried to know you don't care Toad playable. :eek:
I do care if Toad is playable; who I don't give a damn about is Toadsworth.

And that "no one cares" blurb was a shitty joke on my part.
 
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