Author Topic: Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story + Bowser Jr.'s Journey  (Read 19546 times)

Mcmadness

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Re: Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story + Bowser Jr.'s Journey
« Reply #320 on: January 09, 2019, 10:18:47 AM »
Not surprised. This series never was very popular in Japan. It's fandom is primarily NA based.

That being said the series sales have been in steady decline ever since BiS so....
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Re: Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story + Bowser Jr.'s Journey
« Reply #321 on: January 09, 2019, 02:34:35 PM »
I wonder if this is significantly worse than normal for Mario & Luigi games in Japan.
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Re: Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story + Bowser Jr.'s Journey
« Reply #322 on: January 09, 2019, 03:29:20 PM »
I think it's a combination of what Mcmadness said, the burnout from the previous forgettable remake, and also just the steadily declining install base of the 3DS as all games recently just aren't doing so well.

Doc von Schmeltwick

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Re: Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story + Bowser Jr.'s Journey
« Reply #323 on: January 09, 2019, 05:30:49 PM »
As the only person ever to dislike the GBA and its graphics, I'll say it wasn't the remake's doing, the series has been in steady decline since Dream Team.

With no Fawful, the grand majority of English-speaking people don't care anymore. And want more partners with personality, like Goombella and Bobbery and probably not Flurrie (she was weird).

Starlow gets annoying. Even Bomb from Partners in Time was better a good portion of the time.

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Re: Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story + Bowser Jr.'s Journey
« Reply #324 on: January 09, 2019, 05:33:54 PM »
I really don't think Fawful alone can hold the series, lol. Neither will the partners. Those two alone won't determine the sales of a few games.

Mcmadness

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Re: Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story + Bowser Jr.'s Journey
« Reply #325 on: January 09, 2019, 05:40:30 PM »
Indeed. Fawful was never the selling point of this series for most people. Even this game he was barely featured in it's marketing. Both the remake and the original focused on Bowser and the bros, they are the selling point.
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Re: Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story + Bowser Jr.'s Journey
« Reply #326 on: January 09, 2019, 05:50:57 PM »
In fairness, since Dream Team, we've had Paper Jam and both remakes. The remakes are generally seen as unnecessary (at least, from what I've seen) and Paper Jam had a lot going against it (Padding, no OCs, people being burned by the Sticker Star elements, etc).
We need a new game, is what I'm saying.
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Doc von Schmeltwick

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Re: Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story + Bowser Jr.'s Journey
« Reply #327 on: January 09, 2019, 05:54:23 PM »
Exactly, something from the ground up, that isn't a cut-and-dry sequel.

Also, with current technology, fully-2D sprites will be better received than stock-looking prerenders. They're more artistic in most cases.

Granted, the SS remake, despite what many people say, has far more soulful animation than the original (which was mostly limited to "bob up and down stupidly" for enemy idles, for example)

Heck, in many cases, actual models garner better reception as well.

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Re: Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story + Bowser Jr.'s Journey
« Reply #328 on: January 09, 2019, 06:01:19 PM »
Actually the 3DS M&L sprites aren't pre-rendered.


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Re: Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story + Bowser Jr.'s Journey
« Reply #329 on: January 09, 2019, 06:05:15 PM »
They don't even LOOK pre-rendered. If they were, the shading is going to be extra complicated and have these little artifacts associated with rendering it and shrinking them down. And there's the problem of the definition of "pre-rendered".

Also, with current technology, fully-2D sprites will be better received than stock-looking prerenders. They're more artistic in most cases.
With current technology.... eeeeeeehhhhhhhhhhhh I would strongly disagree on 2D sprites looking more "artistic" than prerendered sprites. What does "artistic" even begin to mean!?

Doc von Schmeltwick

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Re: Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story + Bowser Jr.'s Journey
« Reply #330 on: January 09, 2019, 06:10:08 PM »
SOME of them are pre-rendered. The Boos appear to be, for example. And besides, there can easily be use of the "change contrast" tool.

As for "artistic," that's obvious. I mean that they conform to reality less, and can do all sorts of strange cartoonish things, since they aren't based off a 3D form, but are just drawn, and as such can take advantage of illusory things better. Obviously.

LeftyGreenMario

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Re: Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story + Bowser Jr.'s Journey
« Reply #331 on: January 09, 2019, 06:15:20 PM »
Oh, you probably mean more abstract, but with today's technology, you can certainly achieve abstraction too via 3D graphics... But I kinda see what you mean, as sometimes, distorting faces in 2D usually doesn't translate that well to 3D, but, well, 3D still allows for it, just look at Luigi's Mansion, Mario Party 2, Dream Team, and so on. And nobody said you can't do a little editing on pre-rendered sprites after the rendering is done.

The Boo does look pre-rendered, but Boo also seems doable, making it look really on-model, without pre-rendering it.

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Re: Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story + Bowser Jr.'s Journey
« Reply #332 on: January 09, 2019, 06:20:50 PM »
Yeah, I know, I'm a spriter.

Anyways, while abstraction is certainly possible in 3D, then don't like to do it, especially on handheld systems. It's more difficult to rig a model to do that, obviously, and if the time care I put into sprites and the fact that they have whole teams to do a fraction of the posing and animating, it's not reflecting on the official sprite artists' work ethic.


This took me 3 days, and it looks better than a lot of official sprites even from recent games that certainly have the software capability.

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Re: Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story + Bowser Jr.'s Journey
« Reply #333 on: January 09, 2019, 06:24:36 PM »
The hands don't appear to remain a consistent size. Yes, a model has a ton of work put into it, far less straightforward as making a sprite, but once you're done, you don't have to worry about maintaining proportions through foreshortening (as I think the sprite doesn't appear to follow) or even about following light logic. And you can do a lot of cool camera effects that simply aren't possible, such as in the Giant Luigi fight where the camera zooms out and pans under Luigi and you see Luigi's awesome size and a tiny Mario on top, and that's not counting the lighting effects you can very easily do with 3D.

Doc von Schmeltwick

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Re: Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story + Bowser Jr.'s Journey
« Reply #334 on: January 09, 2019, 06:37:06 PM »
Yeah that's part of that "artistic" thing (and that I such at hands, even ones as simple as this). This follows foreshortening just as much as Whomps do in the NSMB games, which was my basis.

Anyways, I still see people look at BiS better than DT in terms of graphics, and BiS had artsy, drawn-looking sprites that were fairly on-model, while DT had sprites that resemble models to the casual observer with little graphical history.

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Re: Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story + Bowser Jr.'s Journey
« Reply #335 on: January 09, 2019, 06:42:15 PM »
People look at BiS and like it more because black lines, and black lines, IMO, are overrated.

Doc von Schmeltwick

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Re: Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story + Bowser Jr.'s Journey
« Reply #336 on: January 09, 2019, 06:55:48 PM »
Black lines with little dark gray areas to account for illusion of curve.

One of the reason I like SMAS SMB3 style is that while it has lines, they're gray, not black.

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Re: Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story + Bowser Jr.'s Journey
« Reply #337 on: January 10, 2019, 11:13:45 PM »
Well, if anything, there's a reason I will remember fondly this game: they finally updated the credits telling us who voiced Iggy and Lemmy!
Yuppeee! I was waiting to know that since a loooooooooooong time!

Re: Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story + Bowser Jr.'s Journey
« Reply #338 on: January 11, 2019, 12:41:19 AM »

We finally have names for the SS Company members: Dieter, Beef and Kaley.
Also "SS Company" is localized as "Best Fitness Friends".
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Re: Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story + Bowser Jr.'s Journey
« Reply #339 on: January 11, 2019, 07:33:44 AM »
Fawful has a minion named Beef.

Game Theory: Is Fawful not so beefless after all?!